1 10 114 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/07f27e14d18aa1f029a2ca122b18ee7b.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=JR-ocCSRRgXeUVIoKUGQct5K-KmqqdFBazv37WItpKvrXYqh-itfXmREJyieE3oK-2mFXanT112HiRQ64IHrCy44EUCDUpU6OVWTAjvysE1O9tvFbHauEY0cPGuojDoxZLdSKhB49ubDfWNCwPDzDkbuL4QyB7lqLq46HO71qMjtxDVqQy3Uou32W7eXeBaGqpWRfZ3lDzOTo7yadWe7zwzkUTTQBRn2LfsiO0KO3nT9aMioDRtsQw4WCxkn-3MDXT6psKMGqdcb81mdwcaoURfjw8a%7EEgottF4bIx7EN01MvZED0Lp9QS%7E10zG6l%7EFZudjmvj-Afr0aOwQ6CUGW%7EQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 511313633089f61d7183df1c621ce916 PDF Text Text ��������������������� Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Subject The topic of the resource Chapbooks and historic materials Description An account of the resource The Hoboken Historical Museum is an invaluable resource to the people of Hoboken.  They've been preserving and interpreting the history of the city since 1986.<br /><br />Amongst the resources they produce are chapbooks. Included on this site are chapbooks produced by the Museum that highlight the lived experiences of Hobokenites of Puerto Rican extraction. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource When People Got Together and There Were Feasts Subject The topic of the resource Tom Olivieri Description An account of the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Chapbook Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Holly Metz Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Hoboken Historical Museum Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available <a href="https://www.hobokenmuseum.org/chapbook/when-people-got-together-and-there-were-feasts-by-tom-olivieri/">Hoboken Historical Museum</a> Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of the Hoboken Historical Museum. Copyright held by the Hoboken Historical Museum. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. 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Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Type The nature or genre of the resource Chapbook Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2001 Hoboken Hoboken Historical Museum Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/7e68b5dd1f70c84b6d8324d06dacdff1.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=hdujbFRqBOlKprFcUIthQ%7E0IG8vJ0L3s2H%7EsLJLKUU0ev9121jC9DiHUysQRiJd4vlOcAwsxUxi4%7El9elMqpaCzk64BKogYGmwzvFRSt6V3kZ1reAitbE005%7EOpxNoiqzgZYJgQ68kkbu20nGxM3lwn-29cO322vdqEjlPDhr56TramXJdm7iyO0OSVaa%7EH8JDWxpQbxp9aSGSQSZDNu6cawKJQWIt4zWNtWT-T30kiB-dQX32aAcjspn8vS8J9VgDrJkENlPz4YMezmbEGRHqV0%7Enjf%7Ek82Fy99hnMASbFuWUZ-qqOwfO1yOb5gKSLYSDB6QCDXcFjGPG40U06GjQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 7ded31099f3e618599593fb407f989fa PDF Text Text ������������������� Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Subject The topic of the resource Chapbooks and historic materials Description An account of the resource The Hoboken Historical Museum is an invaluable resource to the people of Hoboken.  They've been preserving and interpreting the history of the city since 1986.<br /><br />Amongst the resources they produce are chapbooks. Included on this site are chapbooks produced by the Museum that highlight the lived experiences of Hobokenites of Puerto Rican extraction. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource We Were Not As They Thought Subject The topic of the resource Angel Padilla Description An account of the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Chapbook Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Holly Metz Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Hoboken Historical Museum Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available <a href="https://www.hobokenmuseum.org/chapbook/we-were-not-as-they-thought/">Hoboken Historical Museum</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of the Hoboken Historical Museum. Copyright held by the Hoboken Historical Museum. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Type The nature or genre of the resource Chapbook Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2010 HHM Hoboken Hoboken Historical Museum Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/142aacc3842e90ab9ebe73803233fb14.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=o2W-wTTa7rRO2yurqtFa3RkWuKslGyQwmh5bGeZDJMKhFZztghHgj-iybWFepmy4krFwtxuldGdAv8u5eqnMMtxVUgGEdehs5zw6aQmcqlwB-q%7EitpNQzXj79Wb7W3UVCCcAioiX52-e2zhOWg9LhOrTkYYJmT7HrFShn-c2pxDo2DT8TI9VLU-EMoFeNXLMDe%7Em8DjHvunabQWcU3-JCZvx5X5K2WbKzRYgWLeK5z8R8lWDay6MQ4L8XL80sqYJLboQk3kQ%7E%7Ea5rclg4zzeP9sxw-Lg0m6OfIF1Ni%7EPth6fx8QBFhSyl56ujQQfvPCOX5Vr-G3%7EYv6nHJM1SO066g__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM ea3a72a2a803fbb2a6752318f182b9e7 PDF Text Text And Then I Started Reading Books RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ �And Then I Started Reading Books RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ A chapbook from the “Vanishing Hoboken” series of the Hoboken Oral History Project �Vanishing Hoboken The Hoboken Oral History Project A Project of the Hoboken Historical Museum and the Hoboken Public Library This oral history chapbook was assisted by a grant from the New Jersey Historical Commission, a division of the Department of State. Additional support was provided by the Hoboken Historical Museum and the Hoboken Public Library. The views expressed in this publication are those of the interviewee and do not necessarily reflect the views of the interviewers, the Hoboken Oral History Project and its coordinators, the Hoboken Historical Museum or the Hoboken Public Library. © 2022 Hoboken Historical Museum and the Hoboken Public Library. For more information or to purchase Hoboken Oral History Project chapbooks, contact Hoboken Historical Museum, PO Box 3296, 1301 Hudson St., Hoboken, NJ 07030; or the Hoboken Public Library, 500 Park Avenue, Hoboken, NJ 07030. HOBOKEN ORAL HISTORY PROJECT: chapbooks editor: Holly Metz designer: Ann Marie Manca proofreader: Laura Alexander HOBOKEN HISTORICAL MUSEUM: director: Robert Foster Unless otherwise noted, all photographs reproduced in this chapbook are courtesy of Maria Peggy Diaz. Contemporary photographs of Peggy by Robert Foster, 2022. inside back cover: 1910 postcard of Firehouse No.2, known as “The Island,” where Peggy is currently stationed. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. back cover: 1910 postcard of the Firemen’s Memorial, Church Square Park. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. So, one of the things I will say, probably one of the things that has helped me even where I am now, in my life, and the way that I see things and the way that I think, was when I was younger, I had kind of this limited view, a limited world, right? And then I started reading books. —MARIA PEGGY DIAZ FEBRUARY 21, 2022 �INTRODUCTION ABOVE, CLOCKWISE FROM TOP LEFT: Peggy, Dad, Yomaira, Mom, her son Isaiah, and brother Peter in Union City, 2009. Her father died in 2010. Peggy and her son Isaiah, 2014. Peggy and her sister Yomaira at Yomaira’s college graduation. Mom with Peggy’s older brother Juan in Puerto Rico, 2000. Maria Peggy Diaz was born in 1973 at St. Mary Hospital (now Hoboken University Medical Center), grew up on Garden and Ninth Streets, and, after a stint in the military, returned to her beloved hometown to become one of the first female firefighters in the more than 100-year history of the Hoboken Fire Department. In 2011 she became a captain. Listening to her recollections of her Hoboken childhood is like viewing the city through an ever-widening aperture, as she describes playing outside in front of the HOPES center, a social services organization across the street from her Garden Street home; the growing number of streets she was allowed to frequent in the city as she grew older; and most of all, the way the world opened up to her through books shared by favorite teachers. A voracious reader to this day, the reminiscences she shares about her life in the Mile Square City are multi-layered, reflecting one of the great gifts readers can receive from books: an understanding of the capaciousness of the world, rich in stories. Nested inside a large extended family that steadily migrated to Hoboken from Puerto Rico, Peggy—the nickname everyone uses—grew up in a Spanish-speaking household, proud of her heritage, and aware she was living in what she describes as a “very Latin” neighborhood, though one that also included residents of Italian and Polish descent. Her stalwart family kept her safe when arson was raging in the city during the 1970s and 80s; the fires killed many residents and permanently displaced thousands of poor and working class tenants of mostly Puerto Rican heritage. [3] �Peggy recalls the fires of that era now through childhood memories deeply informed in adulthood by her work as a firefighter, and the shared experiences of her colleagues. Peggy Diaz was interviewed on February 21, 2022, by Holly Metz and Robert Foster at the Hoboken Historical Museum. Copies of the transcripts from which this chapbook was derived have been deposited in the Historical Collection of the Hoboken Public Library and in the archives of the Hoboken Historical Museum. The Nickname Peggy My nickname is Peggy. It’s not in my legal documents —at all. [Laughs.] So that’s an interesting story [—of my given name and my nickname]. When I was born—on December 9, 1973—I was a twin. But my sister passed away. We were in St. Mary’s Hospital. My mom didn’t know she was pregnant with twins. Her language barrier was really tough back in the 70s. She was really young. She was eighteen when she had us. We were premature. We were born, I think, at six and a half months, and coming from a Latin background, and a religious background, my grandmother was like, you have to name them, after Bible names. Both of them. So she named me Maria and she named my sister Socorro. I don’t know if [Socorro] is a saint—maybe, I’m not quite sure. But there was someone who was helping [my mom], and her name was Peggy. My mom really loved her and appreciated her. So when I was little, she just started calling me Peggy. And it stuck! It’s been with me forever. It’s funny, people ask me that all the time: “ Your name is Maria Diaz, why do people call you Peggy?” That’s where it came from. OPPOSITE: St. Mary Hospital, 4th and Willow Steets, aerial view, circa 1974. Our Lady of Grace church stands just to the right of the hospital and behind that, Church Towers. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. THIS PAGE, BACKGROUND: Detail of the St. Mary statue, Our Lady of Grace church, opposite the hospital. Photograph by Ann Marie Manca, 2021. [4] And Then I Started Reading Books [5] �When My Mom Came to Hoboken So my mom had been living in Puerto Rico. She was born and raised in a town called Caguas. It’s a pretty big town. It’s like the center of Puerto Rico, about an hour from San Juan. Puerto Rico’s a small island, but you know most of the towns. My grandmother is still there. When she first arrived here [about 1971], she was in Paterson, New Jersey, with a family friend. My mom already had a son—my older brother—and she came with him. She was 17, very young. She was in Paterson, and met my dad. My dad was already here. His family was from the Bronx, but he was kind of familiar with New Jersey. [My mom] moved from Paterson to the Bronx for about seven or eight months, with my dad. She ended up in Hoboken because her first cousin lived here, and he told her, “Come here, there’s a lot of jobs; you can absolutely get a job here.” And she ended up moving to Tenth and Garden, to a furnished room. Actually, what’s funny, when she lived on Tenth and Garden, before we were born, it was Miss Fusco [who was the owner]. She was my art teacher in grammar school [later]. It was her house. She had a furnished room downstairs, and that’s where my mom lived, until we were born, and then she moved to an apartment at 923 Garden Street. It was definitely a shock [for her to come here, so young, from Puerto Rico]. I talk to my mom now, even to this day, there are moments when, I think, she’s in awe of how far she has gotten. Or all of the things that she did without kind of having guidance. Is that the word RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [6] for it? Kind of winging it and I think, she was a child raising children. And then moving through her life: “ This is what I’m doing.” But yes, it was definitely a shock. She said, the first time she saw snow, it was like… [It was so different.] I don’t think she thinks she was fearless. I talk to her about it now and I think, to her it was like being in survival mode. Being so young and having a kid and just kind of “ Where can I work?” and “ What can I do?” My cousin is here. “How can I live a better life?” I think that’s what she was thinking to herself. ABOVE, LEFT AND RIGHT: Peggy, Mom, and brother Peter, 923 Garden Street. Peggy (left) and brothers Juan and Peter, who still lives in the Garden Street apartment, 1982. And Then I Started Reading Books [7] �A Seamstress Mom was a seamstress. She started in the factories here, [eventually working at] the Tea building. It used to be a bunch of different businesses and one of them was a [garment] company. My mom was really good with the Singer sewing machines—she’s amazing. I think she started on Adams Street, where there was a factory that used to do nightgowns. On Fourth and Adams, and then they moved into the building on Fourteenth Street. That’s what she did, my whole life, growing up. Joined By Sisters and Brothers So my mom was the first daughter to get to Hoboken. We’re a really big family. My mom has 17 brothers and sisters. They’re here now. [When they began to leave Puerto Rico,] it was [during] the time, I think, the late 60s, early 70s, when there was this huge migration, where a lot of Spanish people were moving to this area. [My mom] was living here, she had my brother, [and] she had myself. (My younger brother wasn’t born yet.) And her sisters started coming over. She had three sisters who moved from Puerto Rico to Hoboken—one older and two younger sisters. They lived with my mom for a year or so. We lived [at] 923 Garden Street. ABOVE: Peggy (far right) with her aunts at 9th and Garden Streets, April 1984. OPPOSITE: Standard Brands Building, now known as the Tea Building, 14th and Washington Streets, which housed many industries including a garment business, circa 1982. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [8] And Then I Started Reading Books [9] �We lived on the first floor, and [one of ] my aunts lived on the third floor. Then my other aunt got here, Blanca, and she came to Garden Street and stayed with us for a couple of months and then she moved to Eleventh and Willow, across the street from Wallace School. There were sections of Hoboken, where you have a lot of Latin people—like there were areas that were Polish and Italian and African American. Family Celebrations and Traditions We used to have these big, traditional Christmas parties. As Latin people, Christmas Eve is a really big event. Everybody stays up ’til midnight and you play in a parranda, and you play all these different instruments, guitar… Two of my uncles came to Hoboken, too, and they lived here. It was just a really big, family celebration. Food [for holidays and every day] was very traditional. It still is. Rice and beans, pollo guisado (chicken stew), and then you have bistec encebollado, a red pepper steak in sauce, platano maduros, which is like sweet plantains, and tostones. Growing up, my mom cooked a lot. She still does that. She still makes her coffee, oldschool coffee, with the cloth. It’s the way she prefers it. She’s like, “I’ll always make it this way.” [Laughs.] RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 10 ] The World of Ninth and Garden I was born in ’73. I was raised on Ninth and Garden, and I think back then, when we were growing up, it’s very different, obviously, to the way kids are raised now. We were always outside. You were never in a house. It was like, “ You’re going to stay outside, and I’m going to clean, or I’m going to hang out with my sisters, and you guys just go outside, and when it’s time for dinner, we’re going to call you back in.” It was a safe neighborhood, because everyone else is doing the same thing. All the parents were sending their kids outside. Our neighborhood was very Latin, but on Ninth and Garden there were a lot of different cultures…right next to us [there were] a lot of Polish families, and you had Miss Raia and her kids across the street, and then you had Miss Fusco down the block. Growing up, looking at it as a kid, I was like, I’m used to this area, and being Latina and being around all these Spanish kids. And everything was so familiar. When you’d go to the stores—we called them bodegas at the time—and it’s so funny, being a poor family, especially when you’re growing up, everything was on layaway. [Laughs.] So my mom would be, “Go to the store and get me bread and eggs and sugar and flour,” and the guy would pull out a notebook and put my mom’s name and write down “ This is what she got, this is what she owes me.” And to us, I think that was pretty normal. It was okay, and it was like a normal thing to do. [Growing up,] I knew that I was Latina and that we had a lot of events for Latino, Spanish people. We had CUNA [the social services organization Citizens United And Then I Started Reading Books [ 11 ] �Street Games for New Action. We needed] a lot of government help because our parents didn’t really speak English; it was tough to learn, or to transition. My mother never did, so she always needed a lot of help. And I think CUNA and HOPES center [Hoboken Organization Against Poverty and Economic Stress, located across the street on Garden and designed to combat poverty through social services], helped her, and they helped us. [HOPES was also our playground.] I don’t know if you remember, the HOPES center was kind of set back, and there was a whole open playground, and there was a gate there. We would go across the street as soon as HOPES center would close. All the kids would be there, after school, 4 p.m. until 7:00 at night. And we would play these games. There was wallsies: you throw the ball and if somebody doesn’t catch it, you gotta throw the ball at them. A dodge ball type thing. Then you had, freeze and tag. You had games like running bases. I remember we had those three-wheelers, plastic. When we were kids, we would start in front of the building. And then you would take off and come around to Bloomfield Street and then you would go all the way around and whoever got back in front of the building was the winner. We would do that all the time, until you got so heavy that you couldn’t really pedal. You would pedal and it would just keep going. [Laughs.] We used to venture out, too, but being as young as we were, our parents were like, “ You can only go to Tenth Street park.” When I was growing up, I didn’t know Hoboken below like Fifth, and I’m going to say, Clinton Street. I just knew my neighborhood. LEFT: Exterior of the HOPES building, Ninth and Garden Streets, Hoboken. Photograph by William Tremper, ca. 1970. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 12 ] And Then I Started Reading Books [ 13 ] �Candy on the Corner [I didn’t go to Washington Street after school.] My brothers would go. Mr. Big’s. I didn’t do that growing up. I think I wasn’t allowed. My brothers were. But I wasn’t. It was like, “I don’t want you in Mr. Big’s. I don’t want you on Washington Street.” The only time I would be on Washington Street, I would probably be with my aunt and my cousins. We would go eat Blimpie on Seventh and Washington. Or you would go have a slice of pizza at Benny’s. Delicious. And we would go to get ice cream, what was that place on the side street? It’s day care or a school now? Magic Fountain. That was one of our treats. My mom and my cousins, we would just walk over and get some ice cream and some milkshakes and stuff like that. I would go to all these places with my cousins and my family. When I became a teenager, in high school, then it was different. I went all over the place. And I remember there was Nellie’s candy store on Tenth and Bloomfield. I would go there all the time; she would have the penny fish. And the five cent and penny chocolates. I still remember her. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 14 ] OPPOSITE LEFT AND RIGHT: Blimpie’s sign recreation, courtesy McKevin Shaughnessy. Benny Tudino’s Pizzeria, Washington St., Hoboken, 1984. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. BELOW: Interior of Nellie’s Deli, featuring owners Kenneth and Nellie Lenz, Tenth and Bloomfield Streets, Hoboken. Photograph by Michael Flanagan, ca. 1976. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 15 ] �Good Teachers and Good Books [What was school like?] I loved my teachers. I have a picture of my favorite teacher [to show you]. So, one of the things I will say, probably one of the things that has helped me even where I am now, in my life, and the way that I see things and the way that I think, was when I was younger, I had kind of like this limited view, this limited world, right? And then I started reading books. I was a huge, avid book reader. From when I first started—I’m talking about Beverly Cleary, and all these girlie books. And all these genres of books from the Scholastics. In grammar school we would get them and we would take them home and [say], “I want these three books,” and my mom—we might have been poor, but my mom was like, “If this is what you want, I’m going to figure this out.” She would give me the money and I would order these books and wait for days for [them] to come in. I was a voracious reader when I was in grammar school. And that probably came from curiosity, but also from my teachers. One of my favorite teachers was Miss Palmisano. She was my third grade teacher. She was amazing. I loved her. I admired her. Every time I saw her I was—she was like the most perfect person ever, you know? I had Mr. Capuano, he was my fourth grade teacher. He was also a really great teacher. I really got into reading in the sixth grade. In sixth grade, I had Mr. Connors. One of the things he did—back then, there used to be kind of these little pamphlets, cardboard information on Greek mythology, and he would have like three of them, and then for two periods in grammar RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 16 ] ABOVE, LEFT AND RIGHT: Mr. Vincent Frank Cassesa, favorite school teacher, and Peggy, eighth grade graduation, June 1989. Marcia Morales (left), Peggy (center), and Sonya (right) in Brandt School, seventh grade, 1988. school, you had to come up and grab one and read about Zeus, and then Zeus had this child, and then the next one. And you would read it. And on the back there would be questions. I was just in awe of Greek mythology! It was like, “I love this!” I would read them all the time. Then I got to seventh grade, and I was just a really big reader. My favorite teacher of all time was Mr. Cassesa. I saw him around Thanksgiving [recently], and I was just hugging him because I love him so much. [Laughs.] I think he struck a chord because he didn’t limit you. Because if he saw you and he saw what your background was, he didn’t put a limit on you and say, “Oh, you’re this little Latina girl,” or, “ You should just stick to what’s going on.” To him, it was like, “No. There’s this big world, Peggy, that you have to [explore]. You’re reading The Outsiders? Well, I want you to read this book. And I think you’re going to love it.” And he was a big reader. But his introduction to a world that I didn’t understand was really impactful. And And Then I Started Reading Books [ 17 ] �I was like, I freakin’ love him! [Laughs.] He changed everything for me. I read The Outsiders, from there I just kept reading and reading. I’ve been like that ever since, and I think, his ideas were out-of-the-box, and a lot of teachers at Brandt School—back then, you had some teachers who weren’t so great, right? And you had teachers who would try to discipline kids, right? Something that would never happen now. But this was back then. But then you had some teachers who made up for those bad apples, because they were interested in getting any kid, not just me, all the different kids, they wanted these kids from Hoboken to expand their focus and their vision. And understand there’s just a bigger world out there. I feel like they made an impact, and that’s what he did. ABOVE: Hoboken Public Library on the corner of 5th Street and Park Avenue, circa 1975. The Kingdom Hall of Jehovah’s Witnesses is next to the Library on Park Ave. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 18 ] Why is Our Town Burning? I’m going to say, for me, the change of Hoboken started late 70s, early 80s. I noticed it. My aunt lived on 11th and Willow [and] I remember there being a big fire [next to her building]. I remember her coming over to our house, because obviously they couldn’t stay in the apartment, it was the building next door. I remember my mom and my aunt talking about it and saying these fires are happening, we don’t know what’s going on. And this family passed away. Obviously, I’m a little kid, they were older than me, [but] all the families know each other. It was: Oh, this family is lost. This little kid burned. I still remember the fire where I think the husband set the fire in the hallway, because he was upset with his wife. I remember that, and I remember as a kid being terrified. Me, my cousins, as little kids, talking about it. “Oh my God, there’s a fire.” And little kids, just making stories up, like: “ You’ve got to be careful, because they’re saying that they’re going to burn the building down tomorrow.” I remember things like that. So yeah, it was like a really scary time. But you felt support. You felt a little less scared because we had so much family around us. My aunts and my mom were really good about looking out for each other. They were very close knit. And my uncles, too. They were very protective of us and would look out for us. So you were scared, but a little less scared because the people who were taking care of you were pretty vigilant. My aunts and my uncles were vigilant about us—and the buildings. To see who was coming into the building, and things like that. But that’s probably when the change started. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 19 ] �As kids, we were scared of what was going on. Because we didn’t understand, especially people my age, right? We didn’t understand, what’s going on here? Why is our town burning? Like, who’s doing this? What’s ABOVE: Firefighters backed by a blazing fire on Observer Highway, ca. 1983. Photograph by Robert Foster. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 20 ] happening? It was all these questions that you had in your head and you didn’t know what was going on. Growing up, as you get older, you start to understand things a little bit better. You kind of start knowing, and people start talking. And then Hoboken, the way that it changed, I feel, the gentrification, what was happening, and all the building owners, they were like, we want to get rid of these tenants. And I’m not saying, I would never say that that’s exactly what it was, but growing up, that’s how I felt. And I think a lot of people who are my age, whether they’re Latino or not Latino, they feel the same way, too. Where they were burning the tenants out because they wanted to sell the buildings and they wanted to renovate, and they wanted to get—you know, we lived on 9th and Garden, and the owner at the time, in the eighties, he was renovating all the apartments, and he told my mom, there’s five thousand dollars or ten thousand dollars, and you have to go. And I thank God, ’cause someone—it might have been [tenants’ rights activist] Tom [Olivieri] or someone else —that was like, “ You don’t have to leave this apartment.” This is yours. And my mom refused to [move]. He was very upset. But she ended up staying in the apartment. And he renovated every other apartment in the entire building but hers, and her next door neighbor’s. She wasn’t sure she had a right, but she was, I’m gonna investigate. And this is what’s going to happen, because I have four kids. She was like, no, something is wrong here. You’re not going to push us out. I’m not going to take your money to go somewhere else. I’m staying here. This is my home. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 21 ] �Vezzetti Fights Gentrification I remember Tom Vezzetti. When he was running for mayor. I really do. I used to think he was the craziest person ever. [He campaigned with a bullhorn on Washington Street.] This guy’s running for mayor? I was a kid, though. [And] my mom said that he…had so many ideas. And he wanted to move the city forward. She voted for him, and she was very happy— short term. [Tom Vezzetti died in 1988, after only three years in office.] BELOW:  A crowd surrounding Tom Vezzetti on election night. Photograph by Robert Foster. A campaign button for Vezzetti. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 22 ] The Community Changes There was a lot of displacement, there was a really big push, to move old Hoboken out, and to bring in new Hoboken. During the 80s…and the 90s, too. [After that,] a lot of [people] moved to different places, like Church Towers [and] Clock Towers. And I think the projects, at the time, was a mix of different people. People started moving, started leaving. To Newark or Paterson or Passaic. So a lot of my aunts—my mom is the only sister who stayed in Hoboken. She’s like, I’m staying here, this is where I’m at. My hometown, this is where I’m raising my kids. And that’s it. [But] all of my aunts moved to Brooklyn. All of them. And my uncles, too. So, growing up, I had five aunts. Four moved to Brooklyn, and one uncle. So every weekend, we would all go to Brooklyn. We would leave Hoboken on Friday, take the PATH train to 33rd—I still remember—and we would take the L train to Brooklyn. We would stay in Brooklyn from Friday to Sunday night. [Was there enough room?] Absolutely not, but we didn’t care! [Laughs.] My aunts lived in different parts of Brooklyn, so we would go a few blocks away, in East New York, or Marcy Avenue, or these different places. We would go on Friday, and I would stay in this apartment with my aunt, and my brother would stay with my uncle, then my other brother would stay here. Our family was so big. My mom probably has the least kids of all the sisters; she has four. And there should have been five, because of my sister. But all my aunts have five or more kids so it was just a big family with lots of kids. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 23 ] �Moving Out of 923 Garden When I was growing up, and I was eight or nine years old, my mom became a Jehovah Witness. She transitioned from Catholic to Jehovah Witness. The Kingdom Hall is next to the Hoboken Public Library. So it was like a big shock. “ What, I don’t celebrate Christmas and birthdays, these different events, anymore?” I didn’t understand what it was. I was born and raised and baptized Catholic, right? And I went to Catholic Sunday school, every Sunday. But [that Sunday school] wasn’t as deep-rooted as the way Jehovah Witnesses start their study for kids. The transition was a little bit shocking. But I accepted it, obviously, because…it’s my mom. I got to really know the Bible and [to] learn, at least, Bible stories. So now I get to high school, and kind of rebel. Sixteen, and I’m like, “ This isn’t what I want to do, I don’t want to follow this, and I don’t want to get baptized, and I want to do my own thing. I have my friends. I just have my whole life.” And my mom was still in this place of…so it was really tough. There’s a couple of things I have to say, so I have to go back. When I was in eighth grade, obviously I grew up pretty poor. There were limited things that my mom could do. Whether shopping, [for] summer clothes, things like that, for school clothes. In eighth grade, I got offered a job at Tucker’s Pharmacy, working the front. I was fourteen at the time. And I ended up working at Tucker’s for a year. So I made money—and that was like, my school clothes and my lunch money and whatever I wanted. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 24 ] ABOVE LEFT: Peggy in Baron's Drug Store, 416 Washington Street, where she worked in high school, circa 1994. ABOVE RIGHT TOP AND BOTTOM: Eighth Grade graduation, circa 1989. Peggy, circa 1988. And then, when I became a freshman in high school, a year later, after working in Tucker’s, the summer between eighth and freshman year, Baron’s Pharmacy offered me one dollar [an hour] more! So I quit Tucker’s and I went to Baron’s. And believe it or not, I worked in Baron’s my entire four years of high school. After school I would work three or four days a week. From three or three-thirty, ’til about seven-thirty. During that time I think my mom and I grew apart a little bit. I was doing my own thing, I was in high school, and I was kind of rebelling. Typical teenage rebellion. Then one of my best friends in high school had a child very young; she was a freshman in high school. And she ended up getting an apartment on Section 8, And Then I Started Reading Books [ 25 ] �on Second and Jackson. And I told my mom, “I don’t want to be a Jehovah Witness anymore.” My mom was like—she was pretty tough about it—“If you don’t want to be a Jehovah Witness, you can’t live here.” And I was like “Okay,” and I moved out. I moved in with my best friend, who had a Section 8 apartment and a brand new baby. I worked in the pharmacy. That’s how I was out of my mom’s house at 16 ½. Of course I still loved my mom and I came to visit. And I used to come see my sister, all that good stuff. I just wasn’t in that household. As a Jehovah Witness at that time, that’s the way she thought. She doesn’t think like that now. She says, “I can’t believe I did that.” But you know, it’s okay. “I Want to Go Somewhere” When I was in high school and partying and doing teenage rebellious stuff, I said to myself, “I have to do something.” Or, “I want to go somewhere, that’s going to help me have discipline, and focus, and just be accountable to myself.” And I was like, “How can I do that?” I can’t go to college, because I didn’t have the grades for college. I was like: the military. And that’s how I ended up in the military. At the time, in 1992, there was a program, that [the military] had just come out with, it was two years active RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 26 ] ABOVE: Peggy in the Navy with a colleague, Whidbey Island, Washington, 1993. reserve [and] four years inactive reserve. So technically, you were owned for six years. But two of them were active, the other four didn’t have to be. If you wanted to be active, you could. Or you could do reserves, or inactive. I did two years of active duty and four years inactive (since I had my son after I got back). But the military had the option for the next four years to recall me for duty. I did my two years. I graduated [high school] in June of 1992, and I was in boot camp on August 26th, that same summer. I kind of winged it, like: Let’s go. It was in Orlando, Florida. It was a co-ed company, so it was males and females in the same company. The military had just started integrating at that time, like two years before when I came to boot camp. So I went to one of the first integrated companies. I [started] in August and I finished in December—boot camp and rate school. I was an airman. I came home for Christmas, and then I was stationed in Washington State. I was there for two years; I worked in Whidbey Island Naval Station. I was a “PC,” which is a plane captain. You basically maintain the planes for the officers who And Then I Started Reading Books [ 27 ] �are flying: You wash them, you fuel and grease/degrease them, inspect and prep them for flight. You help the pilot to launch them out for practice and flying time. I don’t know if you ever watched the guys on the aircraft carriers with the helmets, and they have different colored shirts? I was a brown shirt. So on the airfield I would just sort of have on my headset and give them signs and signals, when to go. That was my job in the military. “A Better Version of What I Am" From the moment I went into boot camp, I was scared. Out of my brain! [Laughs.] I was really, really scared. I was very stubborn and hardheaded, and I think coming where we come from, in Hoboken, from this area, sometimes it was tough to listen to people tell you exactly what to do… And you’re with all these people from across the U.S., who lived completely different from you. So there were times I was like: Well, I’m smarter than you, or I can do this better—only because I came from a town that was tough and people tend to speak up for themselves. This is where I came from. When you join the military, you have these young kids, I’m going to say Midwestern, country, who just have never been out of RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 28 ] their element, and there are times you think, I’m smarter than this person. Or I’m smarter than my boss, who’s telling me what to do. So it was really tough. In that part, because I was very stubborn. But, because it was the military, there was a limit to what I could try and do. And I did listen to them, and I look back on it now and that kind of set me up to be a better person, or a better version of what I am. ’Cause it did. The military taught me. It taught me discipline, it taught me punctuality, it taught me organization, and I learned how to work with different groups and personalities. Which was a really big thing. In the military, there are always issues. The military’s really big—you have hundreds of thousands of soldiers, right? And you do have that, you have the differences and the disparities, you have the arguments, harassment. You have all of that. But they’re pretty strict about a lot of things. The military has gotten a lot better about a lot of things—especially sexual harassment. I haven’t been in the military in twenty years. But it was kind of a learning curve. And they’re doing a lot better. But there’s always issues. I learned pretty quickly how to adapt. And then, when I was in the military, I took a firefighting class during boot camp, and that was my first thought of being a firefighter. I was like, I love this. This is really scary and crazy, and insane, but this is definitely something that I can do. But I didn’t think any further about it, because I was in boot camp. I still had a couple of years that I had to do in the military. But it always stuck with me. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 29 ] �Becoming A Firefighter When I finished my military duty, I came back home, and civil service exams were out, and it was like police [and] fire. And I ended up taking them both. But I really wanted to become a firefighter. Because that one little event, that happened to me in boot camp, stuck. I was: I can do this, I really love this. Audra [Carter] and I were the first two females who joined the fire department. [We joined at the same time]—2002. We had a class of eleven. December 19, we got sworn in. I had a military background, Audra had a sports background. She was an athlete. We came on, and it was a really big deal. I didn’t realize it was a really big deal because I wasn’t really paying attention to that. But it was on the news and it was in the Jersey Journal. And when we officially finished the academy and went to the firehouses, it was a big deal, because you could feel it. You could feel the tension. Of sitting in the kitchen, and there being seven or eight guys, not knowing what to say to us. It was the first time—I’m talking about 2002—they had to take sexual harassment classes. In 2002! It wasn’t even 1996; it was 2002. It was like this century; it’s crazy! Like, you guys didn’t have a sexual harassment class before this? So it was a big adjustment for them. There were no locks on the bathrooms. Lockers—pictures and magazines, and things like that. They had to get rid of all that. So it was a big transition for them. I didn’t push it on them. They’ll know that they don’t have to walk on eggshells around me. And they figured it out. They don’t walk on eggshells. [Laughs.] But yeah, RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 30 ] ABOVE, CLOCKWISE FROM TOP LEFT: Peggy in a fire truck, 2020. Peggy at Engine Company 2, known as “Hollywood,” 1313 Washington Street, Hoboken. Crew for the firehouse in front of Hoboken High School, 2005. Peggy with firefighting equipment, 2008. not for the faint hearted. If you’re a woman and you love this job and this is what you want to do, kudos to you. But you better know that this is what you want to do. You’d better know. And you’d better be comfortable with it. I’ve always worked in a field with men. And people ask me all the time, how can you hang around with a bunch of men? And I think because I’ve been doing it since I was 18 years old, I adapted quickly. I don’t care And Then I Started Reading Books [ 31 ] �that he’s cursing. As long as they’re not disrespectful, then they’re gonna be who they’re gonna be. You know? And I feel that some women are the same way. But I don’t have any issues when it comes to little things like that. I learned how to have a boundary and limits. Because—don’t get me wrong, I love my job and I get along with the guys—there are times where I’m like, “No. You’re not going to talk to me like that.” Or like, “No, I’m going to leave the room and we’ll revisit this argument or discussion because you’re not going to push my buttons, and I don’t want to push yours.” But it took a while for me to get there and learn. And that probably comes from being in the military. And Now, the 20th Year I just started my twentieth year. This past December 19, was the start of year twenty. I became a firefighter December 19, 2002, and then, got promoted, to captain, May 11, 2011. A few of us, actually. Bernie Grilletti, Audra Carter, Baron Ballester, Vinnie DePinto, a few more people. During my twenty-year career, I have moved around to different houses. When I first came on as a firefighter, I was at 1313 Washington. We call [that house] “Hollywood.” [Laughs.] At the time, they had re-done it— ’cause there was a fire in that house—so it was all fancy. Not anymore. But that’s why we called it Hollywood. And it’s on Washington Street, so it’s a lot of sight-seeing, and people get to see you. All of that good stuff. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 32 ] So I was in Hollywood for two years, and then I moved to Eighth and Clinton. I was there for about five years. Eighth and Clinton is rescue, across the street from the high school. That’s where I got a lot of my technical training. I got qualified as a rescue. We did classes, Hazmat, breaching and breaking, lifting and moving. I did a lot of classes in Lakehurst, New Jersey, which is a big place where a lot of fire departments train. For different things—like September 11th. They’ll have a pile of rubble, and a bus turned over, or a car turned over, and we did that type of training. I did that when I first came on. I had two great captains at the time: Moe Andreula and Brian Green. Also Joe Nardello, uptown. They were all born and raised in Hoboken. Phil Picinich, was another one of my captains—because I stationed in different houses. They’re all retired now. Moe Andreula, Phil Picinich, Danny Cunning, John Cunning—both of them, Danny and John, were my captains. And then they became battalion chiefs while I was on the job. They were great [at] training. When I came on the fire department, it was a really big transition at the time. [There were] a lot of old school, very old Hoboken, like all of these guys—even the youngest guys. And we were trained by these older, old school mentality guys, who got a lot of fires. Because they were here at the time of all the fires. Frank Daliani, he’s still on the job, I love him. He’s one of my favorite captains; he’s one of the best captains on the job. These are the guys that trained us. So the fire department was in the middle of this transition, old school to new school. When I got hired, And Then I Started Reading Books [ 33 ] �ABOVE, LEFT AND RIGHT: Captain Phil Picinich and Peggy, 2005. Peggy and some of her crew, Hoboken Fire Department, 2015. Chief Cassesa was chief, and Frank Palmisano, he was a captain at the time. He was very important to my hiring process also. And they were just really great. Now the job is really different; they’re all gone. We have a very young generation of officers. But I think the officers, that includes myself and other people, we still have that old training and mentality, because of those guys. Where the new guys, who are going to become captains—they’ll learn from us, but they’ll never experience the things we experienced. I think that’s going to happen to every generation. [Are the younger ones more accepting of me as a female firefighter?] Yes. That is a difference, a big difference. The one thing that I will say, even when I first came on, and it was really tough for Audra and I, ’til we came to being accepted, I think the accepting part came when we had a couple of fires. And we were there. We were, “Alright, we’re not leaving. We’re here, and we’re going to do the same thing you’re doing.” And that’s how you earn your respect. You earn your respect because you do what you’re supposed to do. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 34 ] [Yes, there were incidents, in the beginning, where there was uncertainty of how it would go.] I’ll give you a perfect example, like one of the first times I had to go up the stairs, [and I had] to carry one of these high rise packs up many floors. I was like, what is going on? Like, I need help with this. It was probably one of the first times I ever picked up a bag. I was like, Why am I carrying this? I didn’t understand, and I needed help. And I had a couple of guys who helped me. And that was like a transition, and also an eye-opener. Like, wait a minute, Peg, you’ve got to carry this thing. It was like a lightbulb goes off. They carry it on their own, you have to, too. And then you just work on it. It’s like, it’s okay, I’m carrying it. It just takes a little bit of practice, maybe a mistake or two. And you do make mistakes on this job. They’re going to see, is she going to carry this up the stairs or is she going to do this, is she going to do it correctly? And I get that now, but I didn’t get it then. [Some of those guys were waiting for me to screw up.] And believe me, I know it, because I experienced it a couple of times. Where the younger generation is not like that. The guys that come on now, they don’t understand the job without women. They’re like, “ That’s Peggy,” “ That’s Audra.” We have another firefighter who just joined. “Oh, that’s Ashley.”It doesn’t click in their heads: There’s not supposed to be women here. But those old school guys taught me a lot. They had knowledge, and eventually, when I was accepted, they didn’t want me to fail. [It took] a couple of years—two, maybe three years. Then it was like, you’re going to do it. We’re going to figure this out together. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 35 ] �After-Effects of the Fires Coming on the job, I saw it, [how those fires from the 1970s and 80s weighed on the firefighters]. I see it now. Captain Daliani is probably the oldest person [I know as a captain]. He’s still on the job. I still talk to Phil Picinich and Frankie-boy. There’s a lot of guys from the past. I remember Mr. Wallington, who lives downstairs from me now. I talk to him all the time, and he says it was heartbreaking. He said it was tough; you didn’t know what was going on. You couldn’t understand it, you saw all these people being displaced. These little kids, hurt. All these things, we carried that all the time, and I think [that was] one of the reasons why—not anymore, I don’t think—firemen had a hard time, and they drink hard, and they party hard. It was a tough, tough life. I would talk to them and you would see it in them. You would see it on their faces, and the stories… I think, now I’m older, but when I was younger, I kind of take it for granted, too. When I was older, and I became a firefighter, I was like “I remember the fires” but until I got in my first fire, it was like, “ Wait a minute, Peggy, do you remember?” It’s a tough career. When it’s active. When bad things happen, it’s hard. It’s a really tough career. But it’s also, I think, rewarding. It’s stressful, in your head, as a firefighter. Always thinking, am I doing the right thing? Am I making the right decision? And you’re always worried about the guys that you’re kind of leading. ’Cause you want to make sure that they get home safe, all the time. So that is a stressor. And I think you think about it even when you’re not working. That’s one of the reasons why they RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 36 ] always say, exercise, and do mindfulness [exercises], things for yourself. Take care of yourself. Because when you’re in a firehouse for those 24 hours, you’re thinking…especially as an officer, you’re thinking ten steps ahead. What’s going to happen today? Are we going to go here? Is this gonna happen? A gas call, are you worried? If you go on a carbon monoxide call, let me make sure that there’s absolutely no CO here. You don’t want to leave and think, I’m going to leave these tenants here. If something’s wrong. It affects all of us. You never want to lose somebody in a fire, ever. We worked the fire on 12th and Washington where the young kid passed away—Applied Housing. I worked that fire, and that was a really sad event, you know. It’s a tough thing. To see people lose— to see people lose everything. Their material possessions, right? But even worse is losing a life. [Is there a connection between my becoming a firefighter and the fires of the 1980s?] There might be. I think so, a little bit. You know, when I was growing up, in the 80s and as a kid, I looked up to the firemen. I used to see them and I used to be in awe of them. There were times I wouldn’t even talk to them because I was so…I used to think, when I was younger, that you weren’t allowed to talk to them. Maybe because I put them on a pedestal. You can’t talk to them. They’re too important for us to talk to. So I do think that seeing what happened in the 80s and these guys do this admirable job, it was like, I would love to do that. Never in a million years did I think I would do it though. But I think that was a part of it, yeah. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 37 ] �Time For More Female Firefighters You know what’s so funny, I did it [joined the fire department] and I didn’t think about it. I wasn’t thinking, I’m making this huge change, impact, or … I just wasn’t. For me, maybe because I was in the military, the transition was like, this is normal. I didn’t realize that it wasn’t normal, until I was really in it, I think. Until a couple of years, and I was like, “Holy shit, this is a big thing.” I see it a lot when I see little girls. I honestly feel the reason there are not more females is because I don’t think women think this is a possibility for them. I think being a firefighter and sometimes, being a police officer, more so being a firefighter, is just, it’s kind of like playing football, right? The NFL . That’s just a man’s sport. And that’s the way people see it, and that’s it. I feel like firefighting is such a strong, physical… and I’m going to say 90 percent of the time, all you see is men. You don’t see women. We don’t have fire gear that’s catered to women. So I think now, in 2022, even the fire service is thinking about it. Like before, when I became a firefighter, it wasn’t like these pants are for women and these are for men. I was wearing the same pants, I was wearing the same bulky gloves, I still wear all that stuff. Now, they’re starting to think, women are built differently, and their gloves should be built differently. Now they’re trying to make the changes. To be inclusive to women. But when I first came on, it wasn’t very inclusive. [Right now there’s] just an open call. But I was having this conversation with my chief, Audra, and we were saying that we should try [to reach out to more women]. RECOLLECTIONS OF MARIA PEGGY DIAZ [ 38 ] We would like to. Audra and I do talk every year to the kids at the Hoboken High School. This last year we had to do it virtually, but quite a few kids attended, and they asked us questions. That was a really fun event. But I feel like we should do more. I need to do more. Audra wants to do more. Women don’t try it because they don’t think it’s a choice. And if you’re not making an effort to reach out to them, they’re not gonna do it. ABOVE: Some of Peggy’s crew, Hoboken Fire Department, 2021. BELOW: Detail from a Certificate of Appointment for Firemen of Hoboken, New Jersey, ca. 1870-90. Hoboken Historical Museum collection. And Then I Started Reading Books [ 39 ] �The Hoboken Oral History Project “Vanishing Hoboken,” an oral history project, was initiated in 2000 by members of the Hoboken Historical Museum and the Friends of the Hoboken Public Library in response to dramatic physical, social, and economic changes in the city of Hoboken over the preceding twenty years, and to consequent “vanishing” of certain aspects of public life. For much of the last century, Hoboken was a working-class town, home to many waves of immigrant families, and to families who journeyed from the southern regions of the U.S. and from Puerto Rico—all looking for work. Hoboken, close to ports of entry in New Jersey and New York, offered a working waterfront and many factories, as well as inexpensive housing. Each new wave of arrivals—from Germany, Ireland, Italy, Yugoslavia, Cuba, and Puerto Rico—found work on the waterfront, at the Bethlehem Steel Shipyards, Lipton Tea, Tootsie Roll, Maxwell House, or in numerous, smaller garment factories. Then the docks closed in the 1960s; factory jobs dwindled as Hoboken’s industrial base relocated over the 1970s and ’80s. Maxwell House, once the largest coffee roasting plant in the world, was the last to leave, in 1992. In the go-go economy of the 1980s, Hoboken’s row houses, just across the river from Manhattan, were targeted by developers to young professionals seeking an easy commute to New York City. Historically home to ever-changing waves of struggling families—who often left when they became prosperous—Hoboken began in the mid1980s to experience a kind of reverse migration, in which affluent condominium-buyers replaced poor and working class tenants, many of whom had been forced out by fire, through condo-conversion buyouts, or through rising rents. More recently, building construction has further altered the face of Hoboken, as modern towers are rising up alongside the late-19th century row houses that once spatially defined our densely populated, mile-square city and provided its human scale. The Hoboken Oral History Project was inaugurated with the goal of capturing, through the recollections of longtime residents, “Vanishing Hoboken”—especially its disappearing identity as a working-class city and its tradition of multi-ethnic living. In 2001, with the support of the New Jersey Historical Commission, a division of the Department of State, the Oral History Project transcribed and edited several oral histories to produce a series of “Vanishing Hoboken” chapbooks. Since 2002, thirty-six chapbooks—including this one— have been published, with the support of the Historical Commission, the New Jersey Council for the Humanities, a state partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities; and John Wiley & Sons, Inc. Vanishing Hoboken Chapbooks The editor of this series chose to call these small booklets “chapbooks,” a now rarely heard term for a once-common object. And so, a brief explanation is now required: A chapbook, states the most recent edition of the Encyclopedia Britannica, is a …small, inexpensive, stitched tract formerly sold by itinerant dealers, or chapman, in Western Europe and in North America. Most chapbooks were 5 x 4 inches in size and were made up of four pages (or multiples of four), illustrated with woodcuts. They contained tales of popular heroes, legends and folklore, jests, reports of notorious crimes, ballads, almanacs, nursery rhymes, school lessons, farces, biblical tales, dream lore, and other popular matter. The texts were mostly rough and anonymous, but they formed the major parts of secular reading and now serve as a guide to the manners and morals of their times. Chapbooks began to appear in France at the end of the 15th century. Colonial America imported them from England but also produced them locally. These small booklets of mostly secular material continued to be popular until inexpensive magazines began to appear during the early 19th century. Although some of the chapbooks in the “Vanishing Hoboken” series are considerably longer than their earlier counterparts, others are nearly as brief. They are larger in size, to allow us to use a readerfriendly type size. But all resemble the chapbooks of yesteryear, as they contain the legends, dreams, crime reports, jokes, and folklore of our contemporaries. One day, perhaps, they might even serve as guides to the “manners and morals” of our city, during the 20th and early 21st centuries. �Spanish Baked Chicken and White Rice ONE OF PEGGY’S RECIPES FOR HER FIREHOUSE CREW SPANISH BAKED CHICKEN 4 tbsp oil 8 pieces chicken legs, thighs and/or bone in breasts 3 tbsp Adobo seasoning Freshly ground pepper 5 oz Puerto Rican Sofrito  3 tsp Sazón seasoning 1/2 tsp ground cumin  • • Season with above ingredients and refrigerate for 3-4 hours.  Bake at 350° for 20 minutes then raise oven temperature to 425° for another 15-20 minutes or until internal temperature reaches 165°. WHITE RICE: STANDARD 3 5 1 3 • • cups of white rice (arroz canilla) cups of water tsp salt tbsp of Goya oil  Mix all ingredients in a caldero. Cook on high heat until water starts boiling and then lower to medium low heat and cover rice. Should be done in 45-60 minutes.  Key to making any Puerto Rican rice is to use a “caldero” (Puerto Rican Rice Pot) or a cooking cauldron. A caldero is made of cast iron and allows the rice to cook uniform and also creates a crispy bottom layer to caldero known as “pegao.” �A PROJECT OF THE HOBOKEN PUBLIC LIBRARY AND THE HOBOKEN HISTORICAL MUSEUM � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Subject The topic of the resource Chapbooks and historic materials Description An account of the resource The Hoboken Historical Museum is an invaluable resource to the people of Hoboken.  They've been preserving and interpreting the history of the city since 1986.<br /><br />Amongst the resources they produce are chapbooks. Included on this site are chapbooks produced by the Museum that highlight the lived experiences of Hobokenites of Puerto Rican extraction. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Holy Metz Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource And Then I Started Reading Books Subject The topic of the resource Maria Peggy Diaz Description An account of the resource Hoboken Historical Museum Chapbook Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Holly Metz Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://www.hobokenmuseum.org/chapbook/maria-peggy-diaz/">Hoboken Historical Museum</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Hoboken Historical Museum Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of the Hoboken Historical Museum. Copyright held by the Hoboken Historical Museum. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Type The nature or genre of the resource Chapbook Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2022 HHM Hoboken Hoboken Historical Museum Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/327b7f1128134b81c4fdc536f26a1d9b.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=X40ocfnyRd7GJ%7E4W5TeVtgOBDL-b%7EzuFBkNooDPT4-mIxSzYonBCQOHu8O2a8fJOOqD8eBn1lLiMbPY3sFuIQajWVspBMJuC-dErVbzFTJuXU8qVhj062QOJFko3Scb4EFM0UwOzx9Dr6KHX6%7EiHOBrf-vra48A-zgc7ABXBcagORI3hAUvTY9wzgxQa3A50Uv1q3WqmsnP3suRY8JMQWPumdtPSopGFvCUqOizYDcAvo0hkYOj6NTWrwN%7EU9OIxXgAeg8aV0CnguRfDPAdu%7Eyt-0v%7EMGCdfMEuQMSPWGwXzTDMsMGQuYh7fMevrJOa%7E-NAivyei1Mdg-a3aYbFmoA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 41739e9f1e08711301c4e10136b517cb PDF Text Text Name/s: Angeles Cotto (in green) and Gladys Cotto (in yellow/cousin) Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas, Puerto Rico Year: December 1969 Short Description: This picture was taken on December 26, 1969; near front of Iglesia del Perpetuo Socorro. They day after Angeles’s sister’s (Gloria) Christmas wedding. �Name/s: (from left to right): Angeles’s older brothers Artemio Cotto, Jose “Cheo” Cotto and her father Domingo Cotto Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas, Puerto Rico Year: circa 1959 Short Description: Here in a test of strength, Cheo asked who was the strongest between his father and brother. They locked hands and Cheo climbed on curious as to who could last the longest. They both let go, at the same time, after the photo was taken. Guess we’ll never know the answer to that question. Photo taken by Angeles in front of her childhood family home. �Name/s: Angeles Cotto Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas Year: March 12, 1977 Short Description: Here is Angeles a few hours before heading off to the church, Iglesia del Perpetuo Socorro, for her wedding. Photo was taken in the back balcony of her family home in Sumidero. She jokes, “in front of the pigpen for a proper send off.” She was 27 years old in this picture. �Name/s: Luis “Guito” Pagan (husband to Angeles) Place: Hoboken, New Jersey (2nd street between Jackson & Monroe) Year: early 1990s (1993?) Short Description: Taken front of Hoboken Low Riders. A bicycle repair shop, on 2nd street between the streets of Jackson & Monroe. If you weren’t sure they were open all you had to do was listen for the Salsa music emanating from the garage and you knew someone was there ready to help. �Name/s: (left to right) (Angeles’s mother) Ramona “Moncha” Hernandez and her grandsons Joel Cotto and Hipolito Cotto Jr. Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas Year: 1973 Short Description: The grandsons were helping give the pigs a bath. Located behind Ramona’s (Angeles’s childhood) home. �Name/s: AnnaMaria Cotto (in pink-Angeles’s sister); (Angeles’s nephews and niece) Hector Peralta (standing), Mikel Peralta, Andy Peralta (kneeling), Annamaria Peralta (far right), (behind the carriage to the right- Angeles’s son) Luis Pagan Jr. (in carriages left to right) Oscar Perez, Glory Pagan (Angeles’s Daughter) Place: Church Square Park; Hoboken, New Jersey Year: 1980 Short Description: Photo taken on a warm summer day at Church Square Park or what the kids grew calling it, 4th Street Park. The second the weather warmed up, sisters Angeles and AnnaMaria would take their kids to the park for a nice day out. �Name/s: Ramona “Moncha” Hernandez (center) Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas Year: 1979 Short Description: Moncha’s 63rd Birthday surrounded by her grandchildren. �(Caption for middle picture) Name/s: Glory (back), Mary (front) Place: Lake Welch; Stony Point, NY Year: 1990 Short Description: photo taken at lake welch. I don't remember much of that day but I will say my Supergirl swimsuit was everything to me. �(Caption for middle picture) Name/s: (left to right): Glory Pagan, friend of the family Grendaly Torres, Mary Pagan Place: apartment in 2nd and Madison; Hoboken, NJ Year: March 30, 1997; Easter Short Description: We always dressed up for easter. My mint dress (far right) was actually my “dama” dress from Glory’s Sweet Sixteen. My mother made the original dress and a year later she shortened it so I could wear again. I even wore it one time for Halloween. �(Caption for top picture) Name/s: (Top) Mary (Bottom) Glory and Angeles Place: Basement apartment at 335 Garden St., Hoboken NJ Year: August 1, 2000 Short Description: Glory found a place that printed photos onto cakes. So she HAD to get one with a photo of our mom. She was 24 year old in the black and white photo. Fun Fact: My dad still carries that photo of her, in his wallet, 47 years later. �(Caption for top picture) Name/s: Glory Pagan (far right- blue dress), Junior and Senior runner-up crowned princesses of local beauty pageant Place: St Peter and Paul Church Hall, Saint Peter and Paul Church 4th and Hudson, Hoboken NJ Year: 1994 Short Description: Glory with three contestants from Hoboken’s Puerto Rican Society Beauty Pageant. The two girls in the middle were Junior and Senior crowned Princesses of Hoboken. Glory entered wearing a blue dress Angeles designed and made for her specifically for the pageant. �Name: Glory Ann Pagan (second from the left) Place: St. Peter and Paul Church Hall; Saint Peter and Paul Church; Hoboken, NJ Year: 1995 Short description: Newspaper clipping of Angeles’s daughter, Glory, on the night she was crowned Princess of Hoboken. It was her second year participating in Hoboken’s Puerto Rican Society beauty pageant. �(Caption for top picture) Name: Mary Pagan Place: Sinatra Park; Sinatra Dr., Hoboken, NJ Year: 2000 Short Description: photo taken in Sinatra Park at the top steps of the amphitheater. One of the go to after school hangout spots for myself and my friends. �Name/s: Angeles, Ramona, Julia Cotto, Mary (baby) Place: Sumidero, Aguas Buenas, Puerto Rico Year: 1988 Short Description: Angeles with her mother and eldest sister. Photo taken at Julia’s house, during a trip visiting family in Puerto Rico. �Name/s: Angeles Cotto, Nancy (Angeles’s co-worker) Place: Garden Laundry; Hoboken, NJ Year: July 2001 Short Description: Angeles worked at a Laundromat at 300 Garden St. in Hoboken. Here she is with a co-worker/ friend who only worked with Angeles for a short while but they became fast friends. �(Caption for middle picture) Name: Angeles Place: Washington, New Jersey Year: 2003 Short Description: photo taken on a trip to Saint Joseph Roman Catholic Church in Washington, New Jersey. �Name: Angeles’s siblings (from Left to right) Gloria, Jose, Angeles, Ana, Polo Place: in our kitchen; 3rd and Jackson, Hoboken, NJ Year: August 1, 2016 Short description: The aunts and uncles, from P.R., came for a visit that summer. Angeles had no idea we were throwing her a surprise birthday party five days after this photo was taken. It was a lovely casino themed. She was really surprised! �(Caption for bottom picture) Name: Brandon Cuevas Place: Hoboken High School; Hoboken, NJ Year: 2016 Short Description: Photo is of Brandon’s Senior graduation photo Class of 2016. Brandon is Angeles’s grandson and Glory’s eldest son. �Name: Dimarie, Luis, Angeles, Kiomy, David Place: 3rd and Jackson, Hoboken, NJ Year: 2018 Short description: Angeles here with four of her six grandchildren. They surprised her with a cake for her 71st birthday. �Name: Angeles Place: 3rd and Jackson; her bedroom/ sewing room Year: October 2018 Short description: final touches to her youngest granddaughter, Kiomy’s Sweet 16 dress and cloak. �Name: Glory Pagan, Luis Pagan, Mary Pagan Place: Fort Jackson, South Carolina Year: February 2006 Short description: Taken at Luis’s graduation from boot camp. He had enlisted in the US Army a couple months prior and my sister and I hopped on a 13 hour train ride to South Carolina to watch him graduate. We were beyond proud of our big brother. He served for seven years; did two tours, one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. In 2013, he was honorably discharged as Sergeant Luis Antonio Pagan. �Name: (left to right) Iris Blanco, Jose Blanco and Angeles Cotto Place: Our Lady of Grace Church, Hoboken NJ Year: May 13, 2019 Short description: Photo of Jose (the youngest of Angeles’s grandchildren) after his confirmation at OLG Church. He’s pictured with both of his grandmothers, Iris and Angeles. �Name: front row: (L to R) Angeles, Kiomy, Brandon, Mary middle row:(L to R) Luis, Glory, David Back row: (L to R) Daniel Padilla, Luis Antonio Place: living room; 3rd and Jackson, Hoboken NJ Year: December 24/25 2019 Short description: We always wanted to have some kind of uniform for Christmas; at least once, be it onesies or matching pajamas or shirts, and take a holiday photo. That year my brother surprised everyone ugly Christmas sweaters. Truthfully they were super cute. We all loved them. �Name: Kiomy Cuevas (grandaughter); Angeles Cotto Place: in our kitchen; 3rd and Jackson, Hoboken NJ Year: June 2024 Short description: Here they are cutting out the pattern for a dress Kiomy designed for a Pride prom. It’s become an unofficial tradition between granddaughter and grandmother. Kiomy’s dream is to be a fashion designer, so she usually dreams up a dress, sketches it out and hands it over to “Mami” as she lovingly calls her and together they get to work on making her dress. �Name: Las Damas de Maria and Father Philip Place: Our Lady of Grace Church hall, Hoboken NJ Year: November 2023 Short description: Pictured here Angeles (back left) with the women led church group of Our Lady of Grace Church, Las Damas de Maria (The Ladies of Mary) during a celebration luncheon. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Pagan Family, Photos. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource A collection of photographs from the Pagan family. Each photo includes additional descriptive information per image, including name(s) of those in the image, location of image, year the photograph was taken, and a short description based on personal details of the photograph's subject(s). Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Photo collection created in 2023. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of the Pagan family. and Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Language A language of the resource English Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Photographs span 1959-2024 Type The nature or genre of the resource Still Image Hoboken oral history Pagan family Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/d2e9d9adce118fde4a813defd92b690e.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=sVOprrhk%7EDpLX-b8inGh8GuPaLWSEpKgX6B%7Er4p%7EbjMVprZBxK3d-K-mb1PLI%7E62CTgjOtOElQZXzDHNhiWuZLJF%7Enm9%7EmBW9od4EmVP7UuZtRMOtoHKQIirHcj244BJDUX0kN6HN8c8mrq9jowWgeRazL8JdPHcv1aaYKCzOeFq%7EJSvaSx8A5ISQyye4vErMfFOIqs1eLcR2DRrkK8RdHwUOiTsljyYW2ZGNfmi8XcU7KzGACierfwKQA8-Ckg7DMvL7oBXQircojkcxT6m0pBioXpg9XuLfWUwOu1cdGGjsI5jrX8Hg2ATRGNTtfOH5U3AWUhd1h80K1224nCcRg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 1468aa1686a9bd36e453d6e4ddc7045b PDF Text Text Janet Ayala These conversations were recorded on Thursday, May 5th, and Friday, May 27th, 2022. SUMMARY KEYWORDS Pinter Hotel, fire, displacement, governmental neglect, abandonment, grief, closure, drug addiction as coping mechanisms, gentrification, trauma, ptsd, depression, anxiety, panic attacks, resilience, perseverance, loneliness, solidarity, hope. Janet: That was not their first fire. It was my second fire and their third fire in Hoboken. I wasn't at the one in Madison Street, the one that happened during the day. It happened right before Easter. But until I saw for myself these news clippings and stuff, that's when I knew. I never knew about the gentrification until eight years ago. Chris: Tell me what you remember about the fire at the Pinter Hotel. Janet: It was around three in the morning, and I was sleeping, my baby was sleeping, and all of a sudden, I sat up on my bed and looked out the window and looked at the clock, and then I looked to the door, and the fire was coming in through the door, and my daughter's crib was right next to it. So I got up, I screamed to my husband, there's fire. We were the last ones out, and when I went to pass the door, I couldn't get to the fire escape because my whole door was already consumed in fire. My husband at the time, he;s deceased now, he turned to control the one that was coming in through the door so he could get me and the baby across. I got to the fire escape, climbed out the window as soon as I climb out the door for the fire escape that the rest of the people had to use just swung open with the force of the flame. As I'm going down the stairs, I hear a woman in Spanish screaming, help me I'm burning in Spanish. At that moment, I thought it was my mother. I ran back up while my husband's trying to get into their apartment. I ran down when I went to run back up, somebody pulled me and took the baby out of my arms. They pulled me by my hair. They took the baby and then they forced me down. And as soon as I finished the last step on that fire escape, my brother's little friend, girlfriend, lands at my feet. All crooked, all arms and limbs all over the place because they lived on the fourth floor. After that, I see my husband jumped out the window because my apartment exploded. At this time, there's no firemen. There was no firemen. And we go towards the window of my mom's apartment, and all you can see is black smoke. We couldn't get to them. There was nothing. I believe that when my mom died, she woke me up. I truly believe that, or else, we weren't going to make it out either. Janet: After I see the little girl land on my feet and see my husband jump out and he meet me downstairs. As I'm looking up from that same apartment, I see the lady that was related to the girl that had just jumped, and she was in the window with two kids. She threw one and they broke the fall. When she went to jump with the baby in her arms, the baby got scared and pushed away and landed on the flame. He was burned instantly when she fell, she didn't fall the right way, and she died. Then I hear that somebody in the front is screaming, and there is a little dress slip, and that's how my mom used to sleep in a slip and undies. So I run to the front of the �building, and I see this lady screaming with a fire right behind her, and she's going to jump because she has no other option, and her leg gets caught on the window. At this point, I still don't see no firemen, and there was a fire really close to us. And after that, that's when I finally saw firemen, and I ran before the lady, I ran and told them, we'll go up. You don't have to go up. We'll go up through the window. And they said, no, the buildings collapsing. So I go back and I find that about this lady out the window, and she, over here, gets caught on that window. When the fireman decides to bring up that stairs, she comes undone, and she ends up on the floor after becoming a human torch. Then she became, I don't know what she became when she fell. She blew open. And at this point, I'm still thinking, maybe there's some sort of hope we were holding on just to shear hope, and the firemen put it out. I know it was gasoline from the bottom all the way to the top, but the firemen couldn't get in there until they think the building was you know, that they could go in. And I stood outside until I saw the four bodies taken out and one body bag Chris: What happened after the fire? Janet: After the fire, I ended up, I got a small studio in Journal Square. I didn't know I was pregnant for seven months because I was only 80 something pounds. I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep. I would get up screaming every night that the building was on fire, and until they checked the whole thing, I could n't relax. And then it turns out I had the urge to eat something, and I went and ate it. I got food poisoning, and ended up in the hospital and found out I was pregnant for seven months. I had no stomach. I had nothing. I was 80 something pounds with the baby that was seven months inside me and the doctors told me we definitely had to do a medical abortion. There's no way this child is going to have any sort of life. And I looked at him and said its seven months, and he said, yes. And is it alive? Yes, then I'm not doing an abortion. I'll take my chances. And I did, and she's 38 now. She’s 38 and has three of our own kids. Janet: And then I ended up we moved around a lot, because not only did we lose everything in the fire, he lost his job. A couple of weeks after he lost his job, and that’s when things really started going downhill. I was diagnosed, I am diagnosed with PTSD, major depression with recurrence, anxiety and panic attacks. I do control them very well. I am on medication. After that fire, my aunt, my dad, they forgot that we existed. We were left alone, not only by Hoboken, but also because of the family people. The people that survived, I was only 17. I never got any help. I never, but nobody ever told me that that was what happened, because after that, I lost my husband. He couldn't deal and he became a drug addict. Then I lost my sister to the same thing because they couldn't deal with what had happened. We lost our mom, we lost my brother, we lost our nephew, which was my sister's son. Even the dog was burned and my stepdad. I was the last one out of that Pinter's hotel fire. My husband and I were the last ones out. And things had to be done. We had to collect money. We didn't have any money to bury them, and there was four. So we went, we had to throw ourselves in the street to get money to bury them, and we didn't live in Hoboken anymore. We lived towards Jersey City and and towards that way, and we never found out anything. They never told us anything. That's the other thing. I've been looking for their graves for years. I couldn't find her grave because it was so traumatic at the time that everything happened that I remember it was in Bayamon, and we went to one and they �couldn't find it. She wasn't there. And we went looking for it. We couldn't find it. It's not marked. There's an open space that's where she's buried. But there's nothing there. There's no marker. We know it's there because it’s 84 and ahead of it is 87 and 86 it's the next one. So we know it's that one. But is there anything there? No. It's right next to the road that they used to come in and out of the cemetery. But I have been looking, I have always wanted for somebody to talk about this. My sister died without no closure. I just lost her a year and a half ago, but she went nuts when she lost her son and her mom. Janet: I want you to know what in my head would be, what would honor my family, my sister that died, what that'll be two years that my sister passed away, and she was waiting for this memorial when the first one was canceled. She was still with us, so she never got that closure. She knew some of the story, but not all of it. She was lost. She got lost immediately after the fire. It didn't take very long for her to lose her way, and when she was finally getting help, and you know, being okay, she got very ill, and was been ill for quite a while, but she would always mention that she wanted to be there. That she needed that. She needed that closure. Janet: Now I'm on a mission. I need to do something to my mom's grave. And I still got to find the other two. I want to do something. And like I said, we're a working family. We don't have nothing extra on the side for me to say, I'm going to go and do this, spend money and spend my time and get this done before I cannot get it done. Because after I'm gone, there's nobody else to write this story. There is nobody that's going to be able to really say what happened before, during, and after these fires. And I know I'm not the only one out there. I know I cannot be the only one out there that can remember so much, because I would love to speak to them. This has been a lonely process, a very lonely process. For many years. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Christopher López Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Janet Ayala-Vazquez. Janet Ayala-Vazquez was born in Passaic, New Jersey in 1964 to parents, Francisca Vazquez-Prado and Ismael Vazquez-Santiago who migrated to the United States from Puerto Rico in the early 1960’s. She is one of three children born of the same parents who like many Puerto Ricans migrated with the promise of better economic opportunities. Janet had a tumultuous upbringing having moved a lot and the untimely abandonment of her paternal father at an early age. Her mother eventually remarried and the family moved from Florida to Hoboken where her stepfather, Juan Serrano, had some family already living in the city. Janet and her family, like many Puerto Ricans during the late seventies and early eighties, experienced firsthand the fire epidemic that plagued Hoboken in the time of its gentrification. Within just a two year span her family had been involved in three separate arson fires. On April 30th, 1982, Janet lost her mother, stepfather, brother Ismael Vazquez, and nephew, Charlie Serrano in a devastating arson fire at the Pinter Hotel which took the lives of thirteen people in total. The aftermath of the fire has marred Janet’s life with immeasurable grief and loss. After the fire, Janet was left homeless without any aid from the city. At seventeen years of age, with an infant daughter she was left to fend for herself and the ensuing trauma of witnessing such violence. To this day, Janet deals with major depression, PTSD, and anxiety as a result of the fire. At the time, just after the fire, her experience was so traumatic that she discovered by chance that she had been seven months pregnant which went undetected due to serious weight loss from stress. Her daughter, Vanessa Serrano was born safely and now has three children of her own. Over forty years removed from the fire Janet continues to put the pieces of that fateful day together. In 2023 she had finally found the final resting places of her family who perished. To her dismay, she discovered that her mother and stepfather were buried together in a cemetery in Bayamon, Puerto Rico in an unmarked grave. This, another painful reminder of her family’s erasure. Tombstones for her family members have yet to be made due to strenuous financial circumstances her family is facing. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Janet: That was not their first fire. It was my second fire and their third fire in Hoboken. I wasn't at the one in Madison Street, the one that happened during the day. It happened right before Easter. But until I saw for myself these news clippings and stuff, that's when I knew. I never knew about the gentrification until eight years ago. Chris: Tell me what you remember about the fire at the Pinter Hotel. Janet: It was around three in the morning, and I was sleeping, my baby was sleeping, and all of a sudden, I sat up on my bed and looked out the window and looked at the clock, and then I looked to the door, and the fire was coming in through the door, and my daughter's crib was right next to it. So I got up, I screamed to my husband, there's fire. We were the last ones out, and when I went to pass the door, I couldn't get to the fire escape because my whole door was already consumed in fire. My husband at the time, he;s deceased now, he turned to control the one that was coming in through the door so he could get me and the baby across. I got to the fire escape, climbed out the window as soon as I climb out the door for the fire escape that the rest of the people had to use just swung open with the force of the flame. As I'm going down the stairs, I hear a woman in Spanish screaming, help me I'm burning in Spanish. At that moment, I thought it was my mother. I ran back up while my husband's trying to get into their apartment. I ran down when I went to run back up, somebody pulled me and took the baby out of my arms. They pulled me by my hair. They took the baby and then they forced me down. And as soon as I finished the last step on that fire escape, my brother's little friend, girlfriend, lands at my feet. All crooked, all arms and limbs all over the place because they lived on the fourth floor. After that, I see my husband jumped out the window because my apartment exploded. At this time, there's no firemen. There was no firemen. And we go towards the window of my mom's apartment, and all you can see is black smoke. We couldn't get to them. There was nothing. I believe that when my mom died, she woke me up. I truly believe that, or else, we weren't going to make it out either. Janet: After I see the little girl land on my feet and see my husband jump out and he meet me downstairs. As I'm looking up from that same apartment, I see the lady that was related to the girl that had just jumped, and she was in the window with two kids. She threw one and they broke the fall. When she went to jump with the baby in her arms, the baby got scared and pushed away and landed on the flame. He was burned instantly when she fell, she didn't fall the right way, and she died. Then I hear that somebody in the front is screaming, and there is a little dress slip, and that's how my mom used to sleep in a slip and undies. So I run to the front of the building, and I see this lady screaming with a fire right behind her, and she's going to jump because she has no other option, and her leg gets caught on the window. At this point, I still don't see no firemen, and there was a fire really close to us. And after that, that's when I finally saw firemen, and I ran before the lady, I ran and told them, we'll go up. You don't have to go up. We'll go up through the window. And they said, no, the buildings collapsing. So I go back and I find that about this lady out the window, and she, over here, gets caught on that window. When the fireman decides to bring up that stairs, she comes undone, and she ends up on the floor after becoming a human torch. Then she became, I don't know what she became when she fell. She blew open. And at this point, I'm still thinking, maybe there's some sort of hope we were holding on just to shear hope, and the firemen put it out. I know it was gasoline from the bottom all the way to the top, but the firemen couldn't get in there until they think the building was you know, that they could go in. And I stood outside until I saw the four bodies taken out and one body bag Chris: What happened after the fire? Janet: After the fire, I ended up, I got a small studio in Journal Square. I didn't know I was pregnant for seven months because I was only 80 something pounds. I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep. I would get up screaming every night that the building was on fire, and until they checked the whole thing, I could n't relax. And then it turns out I had the urge to eat something, and I went and ate it. I got food poisoning, and ended up in the hospital and found out I was pregnant for seven months. I had no stomach. I had nothing. I was 80 something pounds with the baby that was seven months inside me and the doctors told me we definitely had to do a medical abortion. There's no way this child is going to have any sort of life. And I looked at him and said its seven months, and he said, yes. And is it alive? Yes, then I'm not doing an abortion. I'll take my chances. And I did, and she's 38 now. She’s 38 and has three of our own kids. Janet: And then I ended up we moved around a lot, because not only did we lose everything in the fire, he lost his job. A couple of weeks after he lost his job, and that’s when things really started going downhill. I was diagnosed, I am diagnosed with PTSD, major depression with recurrence, anxiety and panic attacks. I do control them very well. I am on medication. After that fire, my aunt, my dad, they forgot that we existed. We were left alone, not only by Hoboken, but also because of the family people. The people that survived, I was only 17. I never got any help. I never, but nobody ever told me that that was what happened, because after that, I lost my husband. He couldn't deal and he became a drug addict. Then I lost my sister to the same thing because they couldn't deal with what had happened. We lost our mom, we lost my brother, we lost our nephew, which was my sister's son. Even the dog was burned and my stepdad. I was the last one out of that Pinter's hotel fire. My husband and I were the last ones out. And things had to be done. We had to collect money. We didn't have any money to bury them, and there was four. So we went, we had to throw ourselves in the street to get money to bury them, and we didn't live in Hoboken anymore. We lived towards Jersey City and and towards that way, and we never found out anything. They never told us anything. That's the other thing. I've been looking for their graves for years. I couldn't find her grave because it was so traumatic at the time that everything happened that I remember it was in Bayamon, and we went to one and they couldn't find it. She wasn't there. And we went looking for it. We couldn't find it. It's not marked. There's an open space that's where she's buried. But there's nothing there. There's no marker. We know it's there because it’s 84 and ahead of it is 87 and 86 it's the next one. So we know it's that one. But is there anything there? No. It's right next to the road that they used to come in and out of the cemetery. But I have been looking, I have always wanted for somebody to talk about this. My sister died without no closure. I just lost her a year and a half ago, but she went nuts when she lost her son and her mom. Janet: I want you to know what in my head would be, what would honor my family, my sister that died, what that'll be two years that my sister passed away, and she was waiting for this memorial when the first one was canceled. She was still with us, so she never got that closure. She knew some of the story, but not all of it. She was lost. She got lost immediately after the fire. It didn't take very long for her to lose her way, and when she was finally getting help, and you know, being okay, she got very ill, and was been ill for quite a while, but she would always mention that she wanted to be there. That she needed that. She needed that closure. Janet: Now I'm on a mission. I need to do something to my mom's grave. And I still got to find the other two. I want to do something. And like I said, we're a working family. We don't have nothing extra on the side for me to say, I'm going to go and do this, spend money and spend my time and get this done before I cannot get it done. Because after I'm gone, there's nobody else to write this story. There is nobody that's going to be able to really say what happened before, during, and after these fires. And I know I'm not the only one out there. I know I cannot be the only one out there that can remember so much, because I would love to speak to them. This has been a lonely process, a very lonely process. For many years. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Janet Ayala-Vazquez, Oral history interview transcription. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource A transcription of the oral history interview conducted with Janet Ayala-Vazquez. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Interview conducted on Thursday, May 5, and Friday, May 27, 2022. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1980s Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral history (transcription) displacement fire Hoboken Hoboken fires Janet Ayala-Vazquez oral history Pinter Hotel Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/e9625fe37fe57e23f6c91537ea897d12.jpg?Expires=1773878400&Signature=LyPYpF0r5AUWjys-4BqQFeDFFJwkXlMOKdk9OOnXzyW3G%7EwUO5oUyK3wO2Fpx2nBWj7xDlAN1X5d9JciXizzGTTFc5og4gPI6GOU8jzPr6YlumUvhvkBLtSLT4CLtkSyH9r2sMGK%7E6CqUWjCZOIWmRBpQCenpLQUnqaL3XaVVUj0FCfbSeWhVrUMLEBP9XxCeaTG3sVFMzMaOx2zggH2dl3uOFhDvHEH0GXqFdSdXgL0d4pCuChl1nFdPf%7EimqRMSZSGOaMAbQsa98UuqBlnuyRE5Zf2%7Eme6U1fbe4XakU5AsDMjrO4aRl%7EE%7Ef4X5VoQvy7UwYY6mUQsGjwDGDJHow__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 5084f8438ed67ece8a8370e01cb723a8 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Library of Congress Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Military Map, Island of Puerto Rico. Subject The topic of the resource Military Map, Island of Puerto Rico. Description An account of the resource This military map of Puerto Rico was published in 1898, the year in which the United States, in the course of the Spanish-American War, seized the island from Spain. Hostilities began on May 12 with a blockade and bombardment of the city of San Juan by the U.S. Navy. This was followed with the landing off the coast of Guánica on July 12 of a force of 1,300 U.S. soldiers. In the peace treaty that was signed in Paris on December 10, 1898, the United States formally acquired Puerto Rico from Spain, along with Guam and the Philippines. Issued by the Military Information Division of the Adjutant General's Office of the U.S. Army, the map is by W. Morey of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers. The emphasis is on transportation, with railroads, main roads, cart trails, and horse trails shown. The scale is in miles (1 mile = 1.61 kilometers). An inset map at the lower right shows Vieques, Culebra, and several smaller islands belonging to Puerto Rico Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Julius Bien and Company Lithographer. Morey, W., Junior Cartographer. [place of publication not identified] : United States. Adjutant-General's Office. Military Information Division, 1898. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived https://lccn.loc.gov/2021668490 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Library of Congress Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1898 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The Library of Congress is unaware of any copyright or other restrictions in the World Digital Library Collection. Absent any such restrictions, these materials are free to use and reuse. Researchers are encouraged to review the source information attached to each item. For information on contacting WDL partner organizations, see this archived list of partners Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource 1 online resource. Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Map Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant United States of America https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/c2d88931357117f87bd9e8c7aa7f2bd9.mp3?Expires=1773878400&Signature=LiUa1mfg-n5qWXaTjI6gDm0zLwdx8u4uMwEEFxSYIbKvV7X4BD8DouLAYqloOBRcB-4RrNFDdX2rHVObYOE3FOUgCaTWEhWKBeiSN0EUhVRuxGkZL5UIR3QYKaYCnY75CcDuvbSUbfP%7Efbp3HjQmMM6R-jXxn%7ExCsVcvkyuXcmVfH0IrujgTQwdQL2elfCKMWEdu4zZCavCa3jdoSSAPA%7El%7EciPh-4HcmvRh1aOYBHCjwvL54hEtikUMUXTTEG-ET9BV2j542T3kr0xmh4IsU-Y9LvnMBIMSWYe5m7DgWcEMG4S3AXhiw7xgfeIo83lZsx%7EGbYT86tfs1CB-ZYt4-A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM ae6aca2eaa0c286ae5c73acf7720f9ab Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data Digital audio file Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 00:13:55 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Christopher López Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Janet Ayala-Vazquez. Janet Ayala-Vazquez was born in Passaic, New Jersey in 1964 to parents, Francisca Vazquez-Prado and Ismael Vazquez-Santiago who migrated to the United States from Puerto Rico in the early 1960’s. She is one of three children born of the same parents who like many Puerto Ricans migrated with the promise of better economic opportunities. Janet had a tumultuous upbringing having moved a lot and the untimely abandonment of her paternal father at an early age. Her mother eventually remarried and the family moved from Florida to Hoboken where her stepfather, Juan Serrano, had some family already living in the city. Janet and her family, like many Puerto Ricans during the late seventies and early eighties, experienced firsthand the fire epidemic that plagued Hoboken in the time of its gentrification. Within just a two year span her family had been involved in three separate arson fires. On April 30th, 1982, Janet lost her mother, stepfather, brother Ismael Vazquez, and nephew, Charlie Serrano in a devastating arson fire at the Pinter Hotel which took the lives of thirteen people in total. The aftermath of the fire has marred Janet’s life with immeasurable grief and loss. After the fire, Janet was left homeless without any aid from the city. At seventeen years of age, with an infant daughter she was left to fend for herself and the ensuing trauma of witnessing such violence. To this day, Janet deals with major depression, PTSD, and anxiety as a result of the fire. At the time, just after the fire, her experience was so traumatic that she discovered by chance that she had been seven months pregnant which went undetected due to serious weight loss from stress. Her daughter, Vanessa Serrano was born safely and now has three children of her own. Over forty years removed from the fire Janet continues to put the pieces of that fateful day together. In 2023 she had finally found the final resting places of her family who perished. To her dismay, she discovered that her mother and stepfather were buried together in a cemetery in Bayamon, Puerto Rico in an unmarked grave. This, another painful reminder of her family’s erasure. Tombstones for her family members have yet to be made due to strenuous financial circumstances her family is facing. Bit Rate/Frequency Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio) 192 kbit/s Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Janet: That was not their first fire. It was my second fire and their third fire in Hoboken. I wasn't at the one in Madison Street, the one that happened during the day. It happened right before Easter. But until I saw for myself these news clippings and stuff, that's when I knew. I never knew about the gentrification until eight years ago. Chris: Tell me what you remember about the fire at the Pinter Hotel. Janet: It was around three in the morning, and I was sleeping, my baby was sleeping, and all of a sudden, I sat up on my bed and looked out the window and looked at the clock, and then I looked to the door, and the fire was coming in through the door, and my daughter's crib was right next to it. So I got up, I screamed to my husband, there's fire. We were the last ones out, and when I went to pass the door, I couldn't get to the fire escape because my whole door was already consumed in fire. My husband at the time, he;s deceased now, he turned to control the one that was coming in through the door so he could get me and the baby across. I got to the fire escape, climbed out the window as soon as I climb out the door for the fire escape that the rest of the people had to use just swung open with the force of the flame. As I'm going down the stairs, I hear a woman in Spanish screaming, help me I'm burning in Spanish. At that moment, I thought it was my mother. I ran back up while my husband's trying to get into their apartment. I ran down when I went to run back up, somebody pulled me and took the baby out of my arms. They pulled me by my hair. They took the baby and then they forced me down. And as soon as I finished the last step on that fire escape, my brother's little friend, girlfriend, lands at my feet. All crooked, all arms and limbs all over the place because they lived on the fourth floor. After that, I see my husband jumped out the window because my apartment exploded. At this time, there's no firemen. There was no firemen. And we go towards the window of my mom's apartment, and all you can see is black smoke. We couldn't get to them. There was nothing. I believe that when my mom died, she woke me up. I truly believe that, or else, we weren't going to make it out either. Janet: After I see the little girl land on my feet and see my husband jump out and he meet me downstairs. As I'm looking up from that same apartment, I see the lady that was related to the girl that had just jumped, and she was in the window with two kids. She threw one and they broke the fall. When she went to jump with the baby in her arms, the baby got scared and pushed away and landed on the flame. He was burned instantly when she fell, she didn't fall the right way, and she died. Then I hear that somebody in the front is screaming, and there is a little dress slip, and that's how my mom used to sleep in a slip and undies. So I run to the front of the building, and I see this lady screaming with a fire right behind her, and she's going to jump because she has no other option, and her leg gets caught on the window. At this point, I still don't see no firemen, and there was a fire really close to us. And after that, that's when I finally saw firemen, and I ran before the lady, I ran and told them, we'll go up. You don't have to go up. We'll go up through the window. And they said, no, the buildings collapsing. So I go back and I find that about this lady out the window, and she, over here, gets caught on that window. When the fireman decides to bring up that stairs, she comes undone, and she ends up on the floor after becoming a human torch. Then she became, I don't know what she became when she fell. She blew open. And at this point, I'm still thinking, maybe there's some sort of hope we were holding on just to shear hope, and the firemen put it out. I know it was gasoline from the bottom all the way to the top, but the firemen couldn't get in there until they think the building was you know, that they could go in. And I stood outside until I saw the four bodies taken out and one body bag Chris: What happened after the fire? Janet: After the fire, I ended up, I got a small studio in Journal Square. I didn't know I was pregnant for seven months because I was only 80 something pounds. I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep. I would get up screaming every night that the building was on fire, and until they checked the whole thing, I could n't relax. And then it turns out I had the urge to eat something, and I went and ate it. I got food poisoning, and ended up in the hospital and found out I was pregnant for seven months. I had no stomach. I had nothing. I was 80 something pounds with the baby that was seven months inside me and the doctors told me we definitely had to do a medical abortion. There's no way this child is going to have any sort of life. And I looked at him and said its seven months, and he said, yes. And is it alive? Yes, then I'm not doing an abortion. I'll take my chances. And I did, and she's 38 now. She’s 38 and has three of our own kids. Janet: And then I ended up we moved around a lot, because not only did we lose everything in the fire, he lost his job. A couple of weeks after he lost his job, and that’s when things really started going downhill. I was diagnosed, I am diagnosed with PTSD, major depression with recurrence, anxiety and panic attacks. I do control them very well. I am on medication. After that fire, my aunt, my dad, they forgot that we existed. We were left alone, not only by Hoboken, but also because of the family people. The people that survived, I was only 17. I never got any help. I never, but nobody ever told me that that was what happened, because after that, I lost my husband. He couldn't deal and he became a drug addict. Then I lost my sister to the same thing because they couldn't deal with what had happened. We lost our mom, we lost my brother, we lost our nephew, which was my sister's son. Even the dog was burned and my stepdad. I was the last one out of that Pinter's hotel fire. My husband and I were the last ones out. And things had to be done. We had to collect money. We didn't have any money to bury them, and there was four. So we went, we had to throw ourselves in the street to get money to bury them, and we didn't live in Hoboken anymore. We lived towards Jersey City and and towards that way, and we never found out anything. They never told us anything. That's the other thing. I've been looking for their graves for years. I couldn't find her grave because it was so traumatic at the time that everything happened that I remember it was in Bayamon, and we went to one and they couldn't find it. She wasn't there. And we went looking for it. We couldn't find it. It's not marked. There's an open space that's where she's buried. But there's nothing there. There's no marker. We know it's there because it’s 84 and ahead of it is 87 and 86 it's the next one. So we know it's that one. But is there anything there? No. It's right next to the road that they used to come in and out of the cemetery. But I have been looking, I have always wanted for somebody to talk about this. My sister died without no closure. I just lost her a year and a half ago, but she went nuts when she lost her son and her mom. Janet: I want you to know what in my head would be, what would honor my family, my sister that died, what that'll be two years that my sister passed away, and she was waiting for this memorial when the first one was canceled. She was still with us, so she never got that closure. She knew some of the story, but not all of it. She was lost. She got lost immediately after the fire. It didn't take very long for her to lose her way, and when she was finally getting help, and you know, being okay, she got very ill, and was been ill for quite a while, but she would always mention that she wanted to be there. That she needed that. She needed that closure. Janet: Now I'm on a mission. I need to do something to my mom's grave. And I still got to find the other two. I want to do something. And like I said, we're a working family. We don't have nothing extra on the side for me to say, I'm going to go and do this, spend money and spend my time and get this done before I cannot get it done. Because after I'm gone, there's nobody else to write this story. There is nobody that's going to be able to really say what happened before, during, and after these fires. And I know I'm not the only one out there. I know I cannot be the only one out there that can remember so much, because I would love to speak to them. This has been a lonely process, a very lonely process. For many years. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Janet Ayala-Vazquez, Oral history interview audio recording. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource The digital audio recording of the oral history interview conducted with Janet Ayala-Vazquez. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Interview conducted on Thursday, May 5, and Friday, May 27, 2022. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource MP3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral history (digital audio file) Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1980s displacement fire Hoboken Hoboken fires Janet Ayala-Vazquez oral history Pinter Hotel Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/91ac7e025ee86098f41ea5a055557564.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=B8lDcsShlOwJxnU9LLhjnDJYljgiTtO1RoGHL5vcCJX-y2-0AbLQ-5NUlF%7EzkUDep-3l6FZUNGXhVNxhQDLdmPaesx8zVQYJOCcBpK9dxT6g-U7JfP1UGypIMGrf83diNw0kUXAauHS5k5WSyIwUx63A%7EvWez0UA8E53-mrx2rWthk2OTKwQdAOMZIN0VQ%7EXU2wGD0J4zTcEWXDk36PUfcaA3zWUWl7sUWosJ-RFvzoQFjLeI69beafzUofsmwCP9Hs26q41Zq2saZxkbRQtbU0owuzNoL46xX3AM6Ziced-2q3DyqvhT96uUwlk7ABoXNPdG397jpKAG0kTU7ujzQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 1fbd7910f297d4071a4f29b5b0cd5745 PDF Text Text Janet Ayala near her home in Deltona, Florida in 2022 holding one of the only images of her mother, Francisca Vazquez that remains. �Family photographs of the Vazquez-Serrano family on a mantle in Janet’s home. �A superimposed photograph of Janet’ brother, Ismael Vazquez, who died in the Pinter Hotel fire in 1982, with his great grandmother. �Janet, her brother Edwin, and sister, Noemi, with their mother Francisca in Florida right before migrating to Hoboken. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Janet Ayala-Vazquez, Photos. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource A collection of photographs from Janet Ayala-Vazquez. Each photo includes a short description based on personal details of the photo's subject(s). Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Photo collection created in 2022. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of Janet Ayala-Vazquez and Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Still Image Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Photographs created in 2022; scans of archival photos created in 2022 displacement fire Hoboken Hoboken fires Janet Ayala-Vazquez oral history Pinter Hotel Puerto Rican Puerto Rico https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/7499f955957b79dccab1da4a9b3bde52.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=Aq3WIykwOlsITL5y0Y73KBKmzC-QWsmoxwtJlHTiRigmuW0HLHb1WiwPTZFVn2sqGdmUnsnNN7Q0dqssQ6hF1rwD0OeIHDHpQmP-KNFHcIvcNGtF%7EKU8Si6u2CvHgubD-PawvMz%7EvObfHvRS-6POUB%7EXhAVC9Fh98x4OnGh295rGsbcf7-6R77Lh8GZy9WMIfVPks89uMSdkoB6LU6ojkYHD513pWtwQQ3fYynczIsQuDHdK4CKNmQ%7ETv96PBA-iZjT0TUJLAEKGz%7E98vLxEXqqTw9vYxePgqDw8n5ZvodA-CrgoUjaPucvkqlp7Dnr77z5YYC7SFnJi7MHu6B5iHQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM a7c2612292e2cfaf57873a490983d4c5 PDF Text Text TRXN_FrankGuzman_P1_240627_1203 Frank Guzman Experts from the oral history of Frank Guzman. This interview was conducted on June, 27, 2024 Topics Discussed: ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● ● The gentrification of the city Racism in Hoboken Puerto Rican community in Hoboken Mayoral Elections The denial of employment due to nepotism Growing up in Hoboken Parents migration from Puerto Rico Gentrification Displacement Harassment from Real Estate agent The Riots in Hoboken Racial tensions Displacement Fighting Fires in Hoboken Discrimination Tom Vezzetti The first Latino fireman in Hoboken Feliz Santiago Old fire captains Living in Public Housing The traumatic effects of violence due ti racial tensions Fighting fires in Hoboken Frank: I think my father mentioned one time that he needed to get on with his life. He needed to make money and in Puerto Rico you couldn't make money. My father came here in 1950. I believe it was 55 maybe or 56 they moved to Hammonton. My sister was born in Hammonton. I was born in Somers Point. But we were living in Atlantic City at the time, but Atlantic City didn't have a maternity hospital. So they shipped my mother out to Somers Point, New Jersey which was the neighboring town. My mom gave birth to me there in Somers Point and then six months later, my father came to Hoboken. Chris: Why did he come to Hoboken? Frank: I want to say he was looking for a better place to stay. We had maybe a little family here. My father, well, he had relatives in Atlantic City, my mother's sister lived there. We had family in Brooklyn, down in Flatbush, and Ditmars was my father's two sisters. And when we came to �Hoboken, one of the first places that I remember living on it was on second and River Street where it's all brand new now. Chris: How old were you when you came? Frank: I was six months old. My father grabbed me and my sister and we moved here. I went to all the school systems in the city of Hoboken. I went to David Rue School, which was on third and Park Avenue. From David Rue school, I went to number eight school, which was Sadie F. Leinkauf. When I was, we were moving again, and then I went to number 8 school. From seventh grade to ninth grade I went to Joseph F. Brandt school on ninth and park. And then I went to Hoboken High School from 73 to 76 on eighth and Clinton where I grew up on 715 Clinton Street for many years before we got gentrificated out to the projects. My mother was affected by that. A real estate agent came to my mom's house without, we weren't home, my mom was alone. My father was working, we were at school. And he said to my mother, you know, you gotta move. My mother started crying she says what are you talking about? He says, you got to move we’re selling the building. Just move and I came home from school and saw my mother crying. This guy said, We got to move. So I ran downstairs, I saw the guy come out of the house and I said, what are you doing messing with my mom? He goes, shut up kid, you got to move that's the bottom line. Of course, I got a little verbally abusive, but I was only like 13, 14 years old. And he was an adult already. I still see him around. I want to, every time I see him I want to punch him in the head. But, you know, they threw us down, well, they didn't throw us down to the projects. My mother had a compadre, my sister's godmother who sponsored a confirmation and she said listen, I got no place to stay. I gotta move from Clinton street, can you take care of my boys? And will give me whatever you need. She goes, I'll take care of the boys but I ain't taking the girls because I got five boys on my own. There was eight guys in one apartment, in the projects. We grew up together for a couple, I want to say about a year, close to a year. So, you know, we made it, you know, and then we got to an apartment in the projects. We lived at 310 with them and 311 was connected so we got 311 on the seventh floor. Chris: In Clinton growing up there was a lot of Puerto Ricans where you were at? Frank: I remember growing up in Hoboken. I want to say 63% of Hoboken was Hispanic. My era growing up in Hoboken in that time was the best years that I believe any child could grown up in. Kids don't know today about 1, 2, 3 red light, Johnny and the Pony, Hot Pizza and Butter, Horse, Marbles, spinning the top, bottle caps in the middle of the street. I used to play handball at 10th Street Park, basketball at 10th Street Park. Hoboken’s a square mile. You really can't get lost once you get acclimated with it. I remember as a kid trying to go to the YMCA, which is on 13 and Washington, where my old firehouse is at and I got lost. I still remember the lamp posts, like a column of two jockeys one on each post holding a lantern. This guy was German and he was a very, I don't know if I'm using the word right but a repressed man. He was very nasty. So I remember going on the stand and he was like, what are you doing here this is my house? I said, I'm lost. I was crying, I was probably around 10 or 11 years old. And I remember finding the YMCA and I remember like saying how am I gonna get home? I don't know how to get home. And I don't remember how I got home but I remember, I got home and I never told �my father nothing about what happened.. But you know, once you got that one experience you learned where you were at. And I was always vigilant of what street I was on. So I know where I could walk. Chris: What do you mean that you could walk or you can't walk in because back then there were places where you couldn't go? Frank: You had certain areas that were hotspots that you had better not got caught in as a kid because people will judge you. Chris: How? Frank: You know you're guilty by association (chuckles)? Chris: It’s because you were brown (laughs) Frank: I don't know if it was specifically that. I mean, for the most part with my friends, We never really had any bad racial issues. But I'll tell you a story that happened right here in this park (Church Square Park) with my sister. It was the Italians against the Puerto Ricans. Something started, there was a guy on a motorcycle and had a girl in the back. She was Puerto Rican. The guy said something and something transpired between the two races. The animosity escalated. Okay, so now it became wherever you saw Italians or wherever you saw Puerto Ricans there was gonna be an issue. So we had the National Guard come into Hoboken. Chris: Are you talking about the riots? Frank: Yeah the riots, it was bad. My sister I forgot who she was with at this park, the Italians were coming from that side and the Boricuas were coming from this side. They were getting closer and closer together and the cops were out all over. So my sister was frantic because she saw the escalation getting out of control. And she was paranoid, and then the cops pulled her and some other people out, thank God. My sister was never the same again. She was always frantic, always paranoid, always scared. Chris: Because she saw the violence? Frank: Because she experienced that and she was never the same after that. Frank: My friends, we grew up together. Irish, German, Italian. And it wasn't a racial thing with us. It was a racist thing with the older folks. Caucasian folks used to tell their children don't hang out with him because he’s Puerto Rican or don't hang out with him because he’s black. And to me, they were more at fault at presenting racism, than we were at fault for accepting the racism. We had to accept it because we had no choice. But my friends we had a world of nationalities. We never had that issue where we had to hide from each other. The racism was mostly in the closet but then it started getting really bad. �Chris: When did you notice it getting bad? Frank: I think just before the gentrification started I started seeing more racism in schools. Segregation, clicks, maybe gangs back in the day. But they were older adults, older tennagers, they used to wear colors. Seeing it was a different perspective because you had people that will not show that they were racist, but deep down inside in their hearts they were. I mean, I've dealt with it numerous times, but I've never took a back seat to it. I’d say listen, I bleed the same color blood and breathe the same air you do. So it didn't become a struggle, it became more of an understanding. But I didn't allow myself to be shut down from whatever others were privileged to do. And I felt well if you can do it, I can do it. Chris: Were you the first Latino fireman? Frank: No, the first latino fireman was Felix Santiago he lives down here at Church Towers. I admired him a lot because when I was a kid I used to watch him and he was always running into buildings without no Scott Bottle. Very little gear on, would go in with a handkerchief. He would go into the building and would come out with somebody. This was back in the 60s, early 70s. I just saw my captain right now sitting outside. Captain Frank Wallington. He was a man that knew his shit. We had a fire in that building right there. I was on a job for maybe a year. Heavy black smoke. I say, hey cap I see you going in there without a bottle? He says, You want to learn how to be a smoke eater? I said yeah, he goes, take a deep breath and follow me. He says, you okay? I said yeah, and he said now, let go of your breath and take a deep breath with the smoke. And I did. I was eating my mocos (snot), I was gagging, coughing. But after a while. I wasn't doing none of that, I was walking in and out. And I learned that from him. He was an original smoke eater. My biggest thing is when I became a fireman I came in where, the oldtimers were there. They were experienced. I learned their style of work ethic in the fire field. Because they were go-getters you know, they didn't hide. They were workers and you worked together as a team. And I was glad that I was raised in that time because these guys taught me how to be a fireman. Beside me asking 25,000 questions you know they were old timers and I was a baby. I was 26 years old when I became a fireman. All the other guys were in their 50s. I learned the pumps first by the high school on 8th and Clinton and that's the rescue 04 engine, which used to be the 06 engine. I remember standing in the back of the fire truck in 1985 bouncing down the street in the back of the fire truck holding onto the sides and I would say, my knees are killing me. They would say, hey kid, when you go in the back and you're standing in the back, you gotta go with the flow. If you bend your knee, the bumps get smoother. Chris: You’ve told me the story before about how you became a fireman. Can you tell me the story again? Frank: Oh, the story about the application? Well, I went to get an application to take the firemans test and unfortunately, when I went, there was no application. Chris: Were there really no applications? �Frank: My suspicion was, in the fire department, you looked at your family, first and foremost, of course. So for me, ,in my personal opinion, they were holding the applications for their families or friends or relatives, what have you. So one day, I came out my house, my mom wanted me to get something from finest (supermarket), which was right across the street from high school which I had to pass a firehouse that when I first came on the job, that's where I was first assigned to. Kind of ironic. When I came out the house, I looked up and said, Oh shit there's a fire in Hoboken. Heavy billowing black smoke from downtown. Now I'm in middle-town, so I could see the smoke dense, it was bad. So I went down the stairs, and made my right hand turn to go towards the High School, which is on Eighth and Clinton. And as I passed the firehouse, the door was open. I said, Oh, shit, the firemen left their door open. So I said, hey let me see if there's an application in the watch booth. So I walked in, there was nobody there, I said, Hello, Hello, nobody was there. I walked in the booth and I saw a pack of yellow paper. And so I took one out and it was the application for the fire department. I could have been selfish and taken the whole pack and went and told my friends, Hey, I got the fireman's application, but I wasn't of that nature. I grabbed one application and put it in my back pocket. went to find this. I went back home and filled the application and sent it in. Back then we didn't have to pay for applications. Now the applications are 35 dollars. So I took the test a couple of months later, I received the civil service notice that I'm taking the test. I believe that was, I want to say 82. Frank: November 13 1985 I became a fireman. And only because Cappiello and Tom Vezzetti were running for mayor. Now, what happened was, we had to go to through that minority quota in the city of Hoboken. And we didn't have that one extra guy so we didn't meet the quota. It had to be either a Hispanic or Black to meet the quota mandated by the state. So I ended up not getting made and we had to go to court. And I started to lose it because I was very upset. I had already taken the test, I passed and came out 26 on the list. And we had to go to court with Judge Sorokin, who was a very angry judge to me at the time, But you know, it was a minority issue and you know, he wanted to know what was going on. Why are we over here in court over a job if there's already a list that was made. Well the thing was that a quota had to be met and they needed another another Hispanic or black body to meet the quota. Us not being on that list is literally why they fought for us to become firefighters. Chris: Who fought for you? Frank: These attorneys which I recall were union attorneys.The judge called in the council and it was kind of scary in the beginning because I said, you know, are we going to make it or not. So from June, we went to court and we lost the case.Then I was wandering around the city in the rain one day. I had just lost my then girlfriend at the time, I lost my apartment and my job. But I was kind of depressed and as I'm walking through sixth and Jefferson or Monroe. So I remember coming up one day and saw Tommy Vezzetti and he said to me, if I win this election, you're going to be a fireman. And I promise you I’ll keep my word. Tommy Vezzetti won the election in November, we won our appeal and he made his firefighters. Chris: Who’s us? �Frank: There were 13 of us. They made us and we got sworn in on November 13 1985. I'm still trying to find pictures from that. And I can't find the pictures from when I got promoted. And somebody's got them out there but you know I lost a lot of pictures that my son had and he I think what happened was he got rid of a box not knowing that had those treasures in there. And especially the plaque there my mom and my dad gave me when I got promoted to captain. It was a, I still think about that plaque now because that was a gift that my mom and my dad gave me and I never got a chance to put it on the wall. Frank: It was a very precarious upbringing in Hoboken with Hispanics and the rest of the world around us, you know, but I learned a lot. I learned how to be respectful. I learned how to be understanding. I learned how not to be judging people because being judgmental in our society today its not something that you want to be. There's too much animosity in this world and children today don't have the upbringing that we had. I think they feel like they're more privileged than we were back in the days because of their upbringing because of like we used to call it back in the day the Silver Spoon. I never tried to be anybody but myself and I think that my father taught me that. He taught me to be the man that I am today. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound Frank: I think my father mentioned one time that he needed to get on with his life. He needed to make money and in Puerto Rico you couldn't make money. My father came here in 1950. I believe it was 55 maybe or 56 they moved to Hammonton. My sister was born in Hammonton. I was born in Somers Point. But we were living in Atlantic City at the time, but Atlantic City didn't have a maternity hospital. So they shipped my mother out to Somers Point, New Jersey which was the neighboring town. My mom gave birth to me there in Somers Point and then six months later, my father came to Hoboken. Chris: Why did he come to Hoboken? Frank: I want to say he was looking for a better place to stay. We had maybe a little family here. My father, well, he had relatives in Atlantic City, my mother's sister lived there. We had family in Brooklyn, down in Flatbush, and Ditmars was my father's two sisters. And when we came to Hoboken, one of the first places that I remember living on it was on second and River Street where it's all brand new now. Chris: How old were you when you came? Frank: I was six months old. My father grabbed me and my sister and we moved here. I went to all the school systems in the city of Hoboken. I went to David Rue School, which was on third and Park Avenue. From David Rue school, I went to number eight school, which was Sadie F. Leinkauf. When I was, we were moving again, and then I went to number 8 school. From seventh grade to ninth grade I went to Joseph F. Brandt school on ninth and park. And then I went to Hoboken High School from 73 to 76 on eighth and Clinton where I grew up on 715 Clinton Street for many years before we got gentrificated out to the projects. My mother was affected by that. A real estate agent came to my mom's house without, we weren't home, my mom was alone. My father was working, we were at school. And he said to my mother, you know, you gotta move. My mother started crying she says what are you talking about? He says, you got to move we’re selling the building. Just move and I came home from school and saw my mother crying. This guy said, We got to move. So I ran downstairs, I saw the guy come out of the house and I said, what are you doing messing with my mom? He goes, shut up kid, you got to move that's the bottom line. Of course, I got a little verbally abusive, but I was only like 13, 14 years old. And he was an adult already. I still see him around. I want to, every time I see him I want to punch him in the head. But, you know, they threw us down, well, they didn't throw us down to the projects. My mother had a comadre, my sister's godmother who sponsored a confirmation and she said listen, I got no place to stay. I gotta move from Clinton street, can you take care of my boys? And will give me whatever you need. She goes, I'll take care of the boys but I ain't taking the girls because I got five boys on my own. There was eight guys in one apartment, in the projects. We grew up together for a couple, I want to say about a year, close to a year. So, you know, we made it, you know, and then we got to an apartment in the projects. We lived at 310 with them and 311 was connected so we got 311 on the seventh floor. Chris: In Clinton growing up there was a lot of Puerto Ricans where you were at? Frank: I remember growing up in Hoboken. I want to say 63% of Hoboken was Hispanic. My era growing up in Hoboken in that time was the best years that I believe any child could grown up in. Kids don't know today about 1, 2, 3 red light, Johnny and the Pony, Hot Pizza and Butter, Horse, Marbles, spinning the top, bottle caps in the middle of the street. I used to play handball at 10th Street Park, basketball at 10th Street Park. Hoboken’s a square mile. You really can't get lost once you get acclimated with it. I remember as a kid trying to go to the YMCA, which is on 13 and Washington, where my old firehouse is at and I got lost. I still remember the lamp posts, like a column of two jockeys one on each post holding a lantern. This guy was German and he was a very, I don't know if I'm using the word right but a repressed man. He was very nasty. So I remember going on the stand and he was like, what are you doing here this is my house? I said, I'm lost. I was crying, I was probably around 10 or 11 years old. And I remember finding the YMCA and I remember like saying how am I gonna get home? I don't know how to get home. And I don't remember how I got home but I remember, I got home and I never told my father nothing about what happened.. But you know, once you got that one experience you learned where you were at. And I was always vigilant of what street I was on. So I know where I could walk. Chris: What do you mean that you could walk or you can't walk in because back then there were places where you couldn't go? Frank: You had certain areas that were hotspots that you had better not got caught in as a kid because people will judge you. Chris: How? Frank: You know you're guilty by association (chuckles)? Chris: It’s because you were brown (laughs) Frank: I don't know if it was specifically that. I mean, for the most part with my friends, We never really had any bad racial issues. But I'll tell you a story that happened right here in this park (Church Square Park) with my sister. It was the Italians against the Puerto Ricans. Something started, there was a guy on a motorcycle and had a girl in the back. She was Puerto Rican. The guy said something and something transpired between the two races. The animosity escalated. Okay, so now it became wherever you saw Italians or wherever you saw Puerto Ricans there was gonna be an issue. So we had the National Guard come into Hoboken. Chris: Are you talking about the riots? Frank: Yeah the riots, it was bad. My sister I forgot who she was with at this park, the Italians were coming from that side and the Boricuas were coming from this side. They were getting closer and closer together and the cops were out all over. So my sister was frantic because she saw the escalation getting out of control. And she was paranoid, and then the cops pulled her and some other people out, thank God. My sister was never the same again. She was always frantic, always paranoid, always scared. Chris: Because she saw the violence? Frank: Because she experienced that and she was never the same after that. Frank: My friends, we grew up together. Irish, German, Italian. And it wasn't a racial thing with us. It was a racist thing with the older folks. Caucasian folks used to tell their children don't hang out with him because he’s Puerto Rican or don't hang out with him because he’s black. And to me, they were more at fault at presenting racism, than we were at fault for accepting the racism. We had to accept it because we had no choice. But my friends we had a world of nationalities. We never had that issue where we had to hide from each other. The racism was mostly in the closet but then it started getting really bad. Chris: When did you notice it getting bad? Frank: I think just before the gentrification started I started seeing more racism in schools. Segregation, clicks, maybe gangs back in the day. But they were older adults, older tennagers, they used to wear colors. Seeing it was a different perspective because you had people that will not show that they were racist, but deep down inside in their hearts they were. I mean, I've dealt with it numerous times, but I've never took a back seat to it. I’d say listen, I bleed the same color blood and breathe the same air you do. So it didn't become a struggle, it became more of an understanding. But I didn't allow myself to be shut down from whatever others were privileged to do. And I felt well if you can do it, I can do it. Chris: Were you the first Latino fireman? Frank: No, the first latino fireman was Felix Santiago he lives down here at Church Towers. I admired him a lot because when I was a kid I used to watch him and he was always running into buildings without no Scott Bottle. Very little gear on, would go in with a handkerchief. He would go into the building and would come out with somebody. This was back in the 60s, early 70s. I just saw my captain right now sitting outside. Captain Frank Wallington. He was a man that knew his shit. We had a fire in that building right there. I was on a job for maybe a year. Heavy black smoke. I say, hey cap I see you going in there without a bottle? He says, You want to learn how to be a smoke eater? I said yeah, he goes, take a deep breath and follow me. He says, you okay? I said yeah, and he said now, let go of your breath and take a deep breath with the smoke. And I did. I was eating my mocos (snot), I was gagging, coughing. But after a while. I wasn't doing none of that, I was walking in and out. And I learned that from him. He was an original smoke eater. My biggest thing is when I became a fireman I came in where, the old-timers were there. They were experienced. I learned their style of work ethic in the fire field. Because they were go-getters you know, they didn't hide. They were workers and you worked together as a team. And I was glad that I was raised in that time because these guys taught me how to be a fireman. Beside me asking 25,000 questions you know they were old timers and I was a baby. I was 26 years old when I became a fireman. All the other guys were in their 50s. I learned the pumps first by the high school on 8th and Clinton and that's the rescue 04 engine, which used to be the 06 engine. I remember standing in the back of the fire truck in 1985 bouncing down the street in the back of the fire truck holding onto the sides and I would say, my knees are killing me. They would say, hey kid, when you go in the back and you're standing in the back, you gotta go with the flow. If you bend your knee, the bumps get smoother. Chris: You’ve told me the story before about how you became a fireman. Can you tell me the story again? Frank: Oh, the story about the application? Well, I went to get an application to take the firemans test and unfortunately, when I went, there was no application. Chris: Were there really no applications? Frank: My suspicion was, in the fire department, you looked at your family, first and foremost, of course. So for me, ,in my personal opinion, they were holding the applications for their families or friends or relatives, what have you. So one day, I came out my house, my mom wanted me to get something from finest (supermarket), which was right across the street from high school which I had to pass a firehouse that when I first came on the job, that's where I was first assigned to. Kind of ironic. When I came out the house, I looked up and said, Oh shit there's a fire in Hoboken. Heavy billowing black smoke from downtown. Now I'm in middle-town, so I could see the smoke dense, it was bad. So I went down the stairs, and made my right hand turn to go towards the High School, which is on Eighth and Clinton. And as I passed the firehouse, the door was open. I said, Oh, shit, the firemen left their door open. So I said, hey let me see if there's an application in the watch booth. So I walked in, there was nobody there, I said, Hello, Hello, nobody was there. I walked in the booth and I saw a pack of yellow paper. And so I took one out and it was the application for the fire department. I could have been selfish and taken the whole pack and went and told my friends, Hey, I got the fireman's application, but I wasn't of that nature. I grabbed one application and put it in my back pocket. went to find this. I went back home and filled the application and sent it in. Back then we didn't have to pay for applications. Now the applications are 35 dollars. So I took the test a couple of months later, I received the civil service notice that I'm taking the test. I believe that was, I want to say 82. Frank: November 13 1985 I became a fireman. And only because Cappiello and Tom Vezzetti were running for mayor. Now, what happened was, we had to go to through that minority quota in the city of Hoboken. And we didn't have that one extra guy so we didn't meet the quota. It had to be either a Hispanic or Black to meet the quota mandated by the state. So I ended up not getting made and we had to go to court. And I started to lose it because I was very upset. I had already taken the test, I passed and came out 26 on the list. And we had to go to court with Judge Sorokin, who was a very angry judge to me at the time, But you know, it was a minority issue and you know, he wanted to know what was going on. Why are we over here in court over a job if there's already a list that was made. Well the thing was that a quota had to be met and they needed another another Hispanic or black body to meet the quota. Us not being on that list is literally why they fought for us to become firefighters. Chris: Who fought for you? Frank: These attorneys which I recall were union attorneys.The judge called in the council and it was kind of scary in the beginning because I said, you know, are we going to make it or not. So from June, we went to court and we lost the case.Then I was wandering around the city in the rain one day. I had just lost my then girlfriend at the time, I lost my apartment and my job. But I was kind of depressed and as I'm walking through sixth and Jefferson or Monroe. So I remember coming up one day and saw Tommy Vezzetti and he said to me, if I win this election, you're going to be a fireman. And I promise you I’ll keep my word. Tommy Vezzetti won the election in November, we won our appeal and he made his firefighters. Chris: Who’s us? Frank: There were 13 of us. They made us and we got sworn in on November 13 1985. I'm still trying to find pictures from that. And I can't find the pictures from when I got promoted. And somebody's got them out there but you know I lost a lot of pictures that my son had and he I think what happened was he got rid of a box not knowing that had those treasures in there. And especially the plaque there my mom and my dad gave me when I got promoted to captain. It was a, I still think about that plaque now because that was a gift that my mom and my dad gave me and I never got a chance to put it on the wall. Frank: It was a very precarious upbringing in Hoboken with Hispanics and the rest of the world around us, you know, but I learned a lot. I learned how to be respectful. I learned how to be understanding. I learned how not to be judging people because being judgmental in our society today its not something that you want to be. There's too much animosity in this world and children today don't have the upbringing that we had. I think they feel like they're more privileged than we were back in the days because of their upbringing because of like we used to call it back in the day the Silver Spoon. I never tried to be anybody but myself and I think that my father taught me that. He taught me to be the man that I am today. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Christopher López Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Frank “Sparky” Guzman, was born in Somersett, New Jersey in 1958. Frank’s parents migrated to the United States in the 1950’s in search of a better life. They landed in Atlantic City and at age 6 months, Frank and his family moved to Hoboken, where they lived at 715 Clinton Street. His family grew to encompass 5 kids in total, Frank being the second born and first son. As a boy, Frank attended the Rue School and even skipped 2nd Grade to enter 3rd Grade at P.S. #8. He developed a love for basketball as a middle schooler at the Joseph F. Brandt School, and was part of the championship winning basketball team under Coach Palmieri at Hoboken High School. Upon graduating from Hoboken High, Frank felt a call to serve. He lost a lot of friends in the Hoboken fires from 1979-84 and wanted to protect his community. He finally got his chance in 1985 when newly elected Mayor Vezzetti appointed Frank to the Hoboken Fire Department. As a firefighter, Frank served his community faithfully for 25 years and had stints at each of Hoboken’s four firehouses. Frank is now the dad of 3 kids, stepdad to 4 stepkids, grandpa of 12 grandkids, and great-grandpa to 3 great-grandkids. He notes with an immense amount of pride that his family is like the United Nations - global and multicultural through and through. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Frank Guzman, Oral history interview transcription. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource A transcription of the oral history interview conducted with Frank Guzman. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Interview conducted on Thursday, June, 27, 2024. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral history (transcription) Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1950s through 1980s Relation A related resource See "Ray Guzman, Oral history interview transcription.," https://puertoricanexperienceinhoboken.omeka.net/items/show/20 displacement fire gentrification Hoboken Hoboken fires Hoboken riots oral history Puerto Rican Puerto Rico racism riots https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/86056/archive/files/8e3a349da4b250583db98c2e9c52fa94.pdf?Expires=1773878400&Signature=DjBLczYIwYnWfpLAGFc0qF9M9SEDxlrmMjvyR2EaFGVtBhMOeYk7H3Dgi5ry4Jc6GOof9sFUmsLm6401VmPj5fGYubW%7EYx7%7ECJzlmOp0WZ5GqdAtiuWyCuwEbGKEB6o6xdS8ZNka9Nh-zbDHt3tmj23GimCE5IEHyu7%7ErFrC9i%7EHJNk4Jysr7Qy0QzsLN%7EdCLrDeSg4p7im4MEC9Akpy3nl419BK70jdN64rssVCd3T-j%7Ek4vd80MrRiRIjD0-F-4RfdcY-r8umyB6GAGW3otxUHh8-ymN8jG65ekuKnmO3uAM7HjKazCAtvzPqYXkVTpw6OZliwjV1p5xMSkkbTyA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM cbc45ca3f76aa426397ee103efa830d2 PDF Text Text �������� Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories by Christopher Lopez Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Frank Guzman, Photos. Subject The topic of the resource Interviews Puerto Ricans--New Jersey Oral history Description An account of the resource A collection of photographs from Frank Guzman. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Christopher López. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Photo collection created in 2024. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Courtesy of Frank Guzman and Christopher López. Copyright held by Christopher López. Restrictions are only in regards to publication; any researcher may view or copy any document in the collection. Note that the written permission of the copyright owners and/or other rights holders (such as publicity and/or privacy rights) is required for distribution, reproduction, or other use of protected items beyond that allowed by fair use or other statutory exemptions. Responsibility for making an independent legal assessment of an item and securing any necessary permissions ultimately rests with persons desiring to use the item. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Type The nature or genre of the resource Still Image Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Photograph collection created in 2024 displacement fire gentrification Hoboken Hoboken fires Hoboken riots oral history Puerto Rican Puerto Rico racism riots